January 04, 2013
On 2013-01-02 00:46, Walter Bright wrote:
> The big news is Win64 is now supported (in alpha).
>
> http://www.digitalmars.com/d/download.html
>
> D 1.076 changelog: http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
>
> A couple issues:
>
> 1. the dlang.org isn't updated yet.
> 2. the OS X package hasn't been built yet (problems with the package
> script).
>
> I hope to get these resolved shortly. In the meantime, enjoy and have a
> Happy D Year!

I create a pull request with docs for UDA's:

https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/d-programming-language.org/pull/231

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
January 04, 2013
On Friday, 4 January 2013 at 12:40:36 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote:
> On 2013-01-02 00:46, Walter Bright wrote:
>> The big news is Win64 is now supported (in alpha).
>>
>> http://www.digitalmars.com/d/download.html
>>
>> D 1.076 changelog: http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
>>
>> A couple issues:
>>
>> 1. the dlang.org isn't updated yet.
>> 2. the OS X package hasn't been built yet (problems with the package
>> script).
>>
>> I hope to get these resolved shortly. In the meantime, enjoy and have a
>> Happy D Year!
>
> I create a pull request with docs for UDA's:
>
> https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/d-programming-language.org/pull/231

Isn't that feature supposed to be here in that form for strategic reasons and should remains kind of hidden ?
January 04, 2013
Walter Bright, el  3 de January a las 23:03 me escribiste:
> On 1/3/2013 9:49 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
> >but other lines like
> >
> >$(LI std.string: $(RED The implementations of std.string.format and string.sformat have been replaced with improved implementations which conform to writef. In some, rare cases, this will break code. Please see the documentation for std.string.format and std.string.sformat for details.))
> 
> Yes, you can put this in as the bugzilla title, though I'd tighten it up a little.

Are you being serious? Do you really think this would be useful for the user?  That the user will be able to spot that particular comment among hundreds of bugs in a bugzilla search query result?

Is really that hard to acknowledge that release notes are better than doing that? I can understand if you see problems on keeping up to date the release notes, but I can't believe that anyone can think is plain better to user bugzilla instead (for the user POV at least).

Can we at least agree on that and then see if is feasible to have good and up to date release notes?

> >$(LI std.range.hasSlicing has been made stricter in an effort to make it more reliable. opSlice for infinite ranges must now return the result of std.range.take, and any range with slicing which supports $(D $) must now support it with the same semantics as arrays (including supporting subtraction for finite ranges).)
> 
> This is 3 separate enhancements, each of which should be its own issue, and will certainly fit as the issue title.

You are missing the point, and even then, from the user POV, is much nicer to have all that information together, because even if they are separated issues from a bug report POV, they are related to the user.

> >Automating the bug list is fine, but don't throw away all of the non-bugzilla stuff that we've been putting in the changelog.
> 
> Nothing has been deleted. In fact, I think those previous items in the 2.060 New/Changed Features are seriously deficient because they contain no hyperlinks for more information.

This have to be fixed in the review process! A change shouldn't be merged unless it has proper documentation!

> But, as I mentioned to Leandro, if someone wants to add some additional notes to the changelog file, that's great. But somebody has to do the work, and in the past there generally hasn't been much effort expended there.
> 
> Me, I've spent more time than I care to think about keeping that list manually updated, badly.

I understand that, but I don't think that work should be optional and only done if somebody feels like. Every pull request should include proper documentation update. Can we try to focus on that for the next release?

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (AKA luca)                     http://llucax.com.ar/
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January 04, 2013
Jonathan M Davis, el  3 de January a las 21:49 me escribiste:
> are purely notes which developers should be made aware of which should _not_ be buried in a list of bugzilla entries where most people won't see them (not to mention, how many people do you think actually read through that list of bug fixes; I think that it's mostly the notes that were at the top which people cared about, and now they're gone).

Exactly. At I don't read the bugfixes list for ages now (specially since they became more and more), I just look for a particular bug if it was bothering me and want to know if it was fixed in this release.

What people will always read and care is the release announcement.

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (AKA luca)                     http://llucax.com.ar/
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A buscar no lo voy a ir
	-- Rata (Pichi Traful, febrero de 2011)
January 04, 2013
David Nadlinger, el  4 de January a las 11:38 me escribiste:
> On Friday, 4 January 2013 at 10:12:37 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
> >No offense taken. It's definitely true that the Phobos developers
> >in general
> >have been spotty in updating the changelog files, and while I've
> >probably been
> >the best at it, it's not like I haven't missed stuff.
> 
> I think part of the problem was simply that it wasn't clear what should actually go into the changelog files.
> 
> Adding all the fixed issues as part of each pull request is not feasible because the frequency of merge conflicts with other pending pull requests would be way too high. Now that we got this aspect covered, I don't see a reason why having a collaboratively managed set of release notes wouldn't work – but maybe it would be better to collect them at the wiki instead of in the repositories?

I think the best way to do it is to put it in the repository where the changes were made (this implies having separate release notes for dmd, phobos and druntime, I know).

This way is trivial to see if some important change deserves a note in the release notes and if it does, for the reviewers to reject the pull request until it has proper release notes.

Having them elsewhere will make the review process very difficult and lots of changes will still be missing.

As part of the release process, we can merge these notes together and add them to the website. Even when doing it manually shouldn't be that time consuming (is only copy&paste), this could also be automated.

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (AKA luca)                     http://llucax.com.ar/
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January 04, 2013
>  FWIW, you can see some info here:
>> http://forum.dlang.org/thread/**k7afq6$2832$1@digitalmars.com<http://forum.dlang.org/thread/k7afq6$2832$1@digitalmars.com>
>
>
Yeah, I read that when it happened. But I don't want to read entire threads months afterwards to see how a feature work.

And, honestly: *no-one* coming from outside this discussion group can understand that 2.061 brings UDA, or what UDA are.


>
>>
> Funny thing, the syntax in the original post by Walter was deprecated from the beginning. The correct syntax is:
>
> @(4) int a;
>
> Or
>
> struct Foo
> {
>     int b;
> }
>
> @Foo(3) int c;


I'll start a new thread on this. This seems to be a major new feature and it appears nowhere!


January 04, 2013
>
> I create a pull request with docs for UDA's:
>
> https://github.com/D-**Programming-Language/d-** programming-language.org/pull/**231<https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/d-programming-language.org/pull/231>
>
>
Nice move!

Too bad I get a pink unicorn from this one. Github is becoming stranger and stranger :)

I guess it should be invisible (
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invisible_Pink_Unicorn ).


January 04, 2013
Leandro Lucarella, el  4 de January a las 15:02 me escribiste:
> > Nothing has been deleted. In fact, I think those previous items in the 2.060 New/Changed Features are seriously deficient because they contain no hyperlinks for more information.
> 
> This have to be fixed in the review process! A change shouldn't be merged unless it has proper documentation!
> 
> > But, as I mentioned to Leandro, if someone wants to add some additional notes to the changelog file, that's great. But somebody has to do the work, and in the past there generally hasn't been much effort expended there.
> > 
> > Me, I've spent more time than I care to think about keeping that list manually updated, badly.
> 
> I understand that, but I don't think that work should be optional and only done if somebody feels like. Every pull request should include proper documentation update. Can we try to focus on that for the next release?

Better later than never: https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/d-programming-language.org/pull/232 (already merged) https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/d-programming-language.org/pull/233

I really can't put all that information (for #233) either in the bug report or the documentation, because is the documentation of a *change*.

I think you really have to *require* updating these documents before merging pull requests that requires them. New (or occasional) contributors usually don't even know where these documents are.

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (AKA luca)                     http://llucax.com.ar/
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And I was gonna give it to him but then I thought you're
just gonna use it on drugs or alcohol.
And then I thought, that's what I'm gonna use it on.
Why am I judging this poor bastard.
January 04, 2013
Walter Bright, el  3 de January a las 22:34 me escribiste:
> On 1/3/2013 9:20 PM, Leandro Lucarella wrote:
> >Examples:
> >http://python.org/download/releases/3.3.0/
> 
> I see a list, one line per, with a clickable link. The only real difference is that there's one extra click to get that list in the D changelog, but then it's a list, one line per, with a clickable link for more info.

You are missing this link in that document: http://docs.python.org/3.3/whatsnew/3.3.html

That's very detailed because Python releases take longer, I don't think we need that level of detail, but I think is a good example anyway.

You probably also missed the link to all the bugfixes in the release, which probably is automatically generated and nobody reads unless you're looking for a specific issue is bothering you to see if it's fixed: http://hg.python.org/cpython/file/v3.3.0/Misc/NEWS

> >http://llvm.org/releases/3.2/docs/ReleaseNotes.html (this link might be wrong because I can't access the llvm website right now to check)
> 
> At the moment, that site appears to be down.

Yeah :(

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (AKA luca)                     http://llucax.com.ar/
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Fantasy is as important as wisdom
January 04, 2013
On 2013-01-04 15:26, Philippe Sigaud wrote:

> Yeah, I read that when it happened. But I don't want to read entire
> threads months afterwards to see how a feature work.
>
> And, honestly: *no-one* coming from outside this discussion group can
> understand that 2.061 brings UDA, or what UDA are.

I agree.

> I'll start a new thread on this. This seems to be a major new feature
> and it appears nowhere!

I create a pull request with some documentation:

https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/d-programming-language.org/pull/231

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg