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July 15, 2009
Re: new DIP1: DIP Template
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
> (stuff)

How about this?

The newsgroups are for discussion.  This includes introducing new ideas
and discussing new ones.

The DIPs are for formally recording a concrete proposal which has shown
interest from the D community.  It should include rationale, examples,
links to important discussions on the newsgroups, etc.

Bugzilla is for formally recording implementation defects.  This
includes tracking the implementation of a DIP which has been accepted.

In essence, the newsgroups are informal discussion, the DIPs are formal,
subjective issue tracking and bugzilla is for formal, objective issue
tracking.

With that sort of setup, ideas for improving the language would start in
the NG.  Once the idea has been fleshed out, someone steps up to
champion the issue and takes responsibility for the DIP.  The DIP then
records the formal description of the idea, links to NG threads, etc.
If it gets accepted by The Grand Council™ [1], appropriate bugzilla
issues are opened and linked.

Sound acceptable?


[1] Being whoever actually has commit permission to the respective part
of the toolchain/libraries/etc.  I'd imagine that for compiler issues,
this would be Walter, Don, the LDC gang; for standard library issues:
Andrei, Sean, the top Tango folks (let's all play nice!).  Or something
to that effect.
July 15, 2009
Re: new DIP1: DIP Template
Daniel Keep, el 15 de julio a las 17:57 me escribiste:
> 
> 
> Leandro Lucarella wrote:
> > (stuff)
> 
> How about this?
> 
> The newsgroups are for discussion.  This includes introducing new ideas
> and discussing new ones.
> 
> The DIPs are for formally recording a concrete proposal which has shown
> interest from the D community.  It should include rationale, examples,
> links to important discussions on the newsgroups, etc.
> 
> Bugzilla is for formally recording implementation defects.  This
> includes tracking the implementation of a DIP which has been accepted.
> 
> In essence, the newsgroups are informal discussion, the DIPs are formal,
> subjective issue tracking and bugzilla is for formal, objective issue
> tracking.
> 
> With that sort of setup, ideas for improving the language would start in
> the NG.  Once the idea has been fleshed out, someone steps up to
> champion the issue and takes responsibility for the DIP.  The DIP then
> records the formal description of the idea, links to NG threads, etc.
> If it gets accepted by The Grand Council™ [1], appropriate bugzilla
> issues are opened and linked.
> 
> Sound acceptable?

Sounds good to me.

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (luca) | Blog colectivo: http://www.mazziblog.com.ar/blog/
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GPG Key: 5F5A8D05 (F8CD F9A7 BF00 5431 4145  104C 949E BFB6 5F5A 8D05)
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Cuando intenté arrimarle mi brazo
Se puso a hablar de Miller, de Anais Nin y Picasso
Y si osaba intentar robarle un beso
Se ponía a leer de Neruda unos versos
Me hizo mucho mal la cumbiera intelectual
July 15, 2009
Re: new DIP1: DIP Template
Stewart Gordon Wrote:

> A nice idea; however, my feeling is that there are too many places for 
> proposing D features.  At the moment, feature proposals are split between:
> 
> - the newsgroups
> - the eigenpoll - http://all-technology.com/eigenpolls/dwishlist/
> - the wiki - http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?FeatureRequestList
> - Bugzilla
> - and now, DIPs

You forgot the peeves

http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?PendingPeeves

> What does this achieve that the others don't?  I think what we need is 
> to consolidate all the still-open feature proposals from these various 
> systems into something that achieves the best of all five worlds.

It gives u place to write thought out proposals that can be accepted, rejected, and revised.

And most importantly, it is a fresh/clean start which fits nicely into the new site layout. And you are correct, consolidation is needed. A clean board makes this easier. Sadly it as a lot of work to move the old into a new formal environment. I will probably add my share, but a issue for me is that I am not knowledgeable on many of the requests to fill in details... then to top it off if I do create them I'll be the one responsible to track things relating to them.

The main hope is that this will provide a way to official and consolidated statements as to when and if a feature will be accepted. It would be nice if Walter were to give an official statement on the existing DIPs so as to create more incentive to formalize existing ideas: 

http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?LanguageDevel#FutureDirections
July 16, 2009
Re: new DIP1: DIP Template
Jesse Phillips wrote:
> Stewart Gordon Wrote:
> 
>> A nice idea; however, my feeling is that there are too many places for 
>> proposing D features.  At the moment, feature proposals are split between:
>>
>> - the newsgroups
>> - the eigenpoll - http://all-technology.com/eigenpolls/dwishlist/
>> - the wiki - http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?FeatureRequestList
>> - Bugzilla
>> - and now, DIPs
> 
> You forgot the peeves
> 
> http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?PendingPeeves
<snip>

That isn't a place for proposing D features.  But that page is stale.  I 
guess I'll just have to see what I can do with it....

Stewart.
July 16, 2009
Re: new DIP1: DIP Template
Daniel Keep wrote:
<snip>
> How about this?
> 
> The newsgroups are for discussion.  This includes introducing new ideas
> and discussing new ones.
> 
> The DIPs are for formally recording a concrete proposal which has shown
> interest from the D community.  It should include rationale, examples,
> links to important discussions on the newsgroups, etc.
<snip>

So essentially, one first discusses a feature proposal on the newsgroups 
(or, occasionally, on Bugzilla) and then, once it's got somewhere, 
creates a DIP.  And then, possibly, the newsgroup discussion continues.

What about ideas that have just fallen on deaf ears the first time they 
 were proposed?  I have a few such things that I'd like to refloat at 
some point....

Stewart.
July 18, 2009
Re: new DIP1: DIP Template
On Thu, 16 Jul 2009 17:17:38 +0100, Stewart Gordon wrote:

>> You forgot the peeves
>> 
>> http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?PendingPeeves
> <snip>
> 
> That isn't a place for proposing D features.  But that page is stale.  I
> guess I'll just have to see what I can do with it....
> 
> Stewart.

Sorry, wrong link...

http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?DCP_Template

:P
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