March 13, 2005
I can't handle this volume any more.

I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!


I'd now have to have TWO laptops, side by side, just to see the threads. By the time I need a third, I'll have to give up entirely.

And to get any kind of overview, even of a single thread, I need two laptops vertically.

That's four laptops total.



I don't care how ingenious, or how stupid the split is!
Just any, whatever!

We (i.e. others than Walter and Matthew) can't read everything, and the way things are, what never gets read becomes increasingly random.

For example, I've now 425 unread posts. If I do any replies (that are worth something, i.e. I need to think what I write) while trying to catch up, I can only see the unreads growing and growing and growing.

How the hell am I supposed to start working on the meta thing, if my entire time goes to reading???



##############################################

Damn it! There are so many ways to split! Please, choose one if you're out of ideas:

  help
  suggestions
  ramblig
  serious

or

  newbies
  non-newbie-problems
  packaging
  language-discussion
  ideas
  other

or

  newbie-help
  serious-proposals
  bar-room-pseudo-philosophising
  other-bandwidth-littering
  intellectual-duels
  proper-discussion

or

  threads-started-by-authors-A..M
  threads-started-by-authors-N..Z
  threads-started-by-Walter

or

  threads-started-in-a-whim
  threads-started-just-because-im-bored
  threads-started-to-show-off
  threads-started-to-pick-on-D-or-Walter
  threads-started-because-im-frustrated-on-d-or-my-wife
  threads-which-should-not-even-have-been-started
  other-hopefully-this-is-worth-reading

WHAT-CRAPPIN-EVER! But please, do something, now.
Pretty please!

--------------------------------------------

Aw,what the heck, maybe I'll just skip this all for three weeks, till I've created an AI filter into my newsreader.

Sigh.
March 13, 2005
Georg Wrede <georg.wrede@nospam.org> wrote:

> I can't handle this volume any more.
> 
> I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!
[...]

> I don't care how ingenious, or how stupid the split is! Just any, whatever!
> 
> We (i.e. others than Walter and Matthew) can't read everything, and the way things are, what never gets read becomes increasingly random.
[...]

I agree with you, that the traffic is too large to be handled by a single instance of human kind without automatic filtering support.

I disagree that any split would do. A random split does not decrease the randomness of unread posts.

So I propose a split into "misc" and "majorgoals", where the posts
on the major design goals on D according to
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/overview.html
go into "majorgoals".

-manfred
March 13, 2005
Well, see being that I write forum software (www.simplemachines.org) I personally think that newsgroups are about as disorganized as it gets. I mean, this group doesn't actually move *all that fast*, but it's all in one place mangling things around.

With newsgroups, it doesn't seem to make as much sense to break it up a lot, except when there are clear and distinct boundaries.

One thing that might help would be a "digitalmars.d.announce" which could handle all announcements (which people might want to see exclusively, and could be cross posted) but obviously that wouldn't split off that much.

Better than creating a newbies section, I think an "internals" section could be created.  The benefit is that all discussion relating to static_cast, length, const, enums, warnings, etc. could be put there... and newbies would probably stay away from it too.  But naming something newbies will not help, because newbies will not post there all of the time :P.

-[Unknown]


> I can't handle this volume any more.
> 
> I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!
> 
> 
> I'd now have to have TWO laptops, side by side, just to see the threads. By the time I need a third, I'll have to give up entirely.
> 
> And to get any kind of overview, even of a single thread, I need two laptops vertically.
> 
> That's four laptops total.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't care how ingenious, or how stupid the split is!
> Just any, whatever!
> 
> We (i.e. others than Walter and Matthew) can't read everything, and the way things are, what never gets read becomes increasingly random.
> 
> For example, I've now 425 unread posts. If I do any replies (that are worth something, i.e. I need to think what I write) while trying to catch up, I can only see the unreads growing and growing and growing.
> 
> How the hell am I supposed to start working on the meta thing, if my entire time goes to reading???
> 
> 
> 
> ##############################################
> 
> Damn it! There are so many ways to split! Please, choose one if you're out of ideas:
> 
>   help
>   suggestions
>   ramblig
>   serious
> 
> or
> 
>   newbies
>   non-newbie-problems
>   packaging
>   language-discussion
>   ideas
>   other
> 
> or
> 
>   newbie-help
>   serious-proposals
>   bar-room-pseudo-philosophising
>   other-bandwidth-littering
>   intellectual-duels
>   proper-discussion
> 
> or
> 
>   threads-started-by-authors-A..M
>   threads-started-by-authors-N..Z
>   threads-started-by-Walter
> 
> or
> 
>   threads-started-in-a-whim
>   threads-started-just-because-im-bored
>   threads-started-to-show-off
>   threads-started-to-pick-on-D-or-Walter
>   threads-started-because-im-frustrated-on-d-or-my-wife
>   threads-which-should-not-even-have-been-started
>   other-hopefully-this-is-worth-reading
> 
> WHAT-CRAPPIN-EVER! But please, do something, now.
> Pretty please!
> 
> --------------------------------------------
> 
> Aw,what the heck, maybe I'll just skip this all for three weeks, till I've created an AI filter into my newsreader.
> 
> Sigh.
March 13, 2005
"Georg Wrede" <georg.wrede@nospam.org> wrote in message news:42340432.4010404@nospam.org...
> I can't handle this volume any more.
>
> I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!
>
>
> I'd now have to have TWO laptops, side by side, just to see the threads. By the time I need a third, I'll have to give up entirely.
>
> And to get any kind of overview, even of a single thread, I need two laptops vertically.
>
> That's four laptops total.
>
>
>
> I don't care how ingenious, or how stupid the split is! Just any, whatever!
>
> We (i.e. others than Walter and Matthew) can't read everything, and the way things are, what never gets read becomes increasingly random.
>
> For example, I've now 425 unread posts.

Only? I've been in a hospital for 10 days and now have 1908 unread only in this NG!

:-)

<snip>


March 13, 2005
What happened to "...we are the world, we are the children.  We are the one to make a brighter new day, so let's start giving..."  You know, "there's a choice we're making.  We're saving our own lives.  It's true!  We'll make a better day just you and me."  Well, something like that.  I'm sorry.  I couldn't resits. If you all read every posts, dang, I'm in the wrong place.  I look at the title and I say, "hhmmmm, not interested... mmmmmm, nope.... hmmmmm, what's this?  Let me check it out."  And that's why I have catchy subjects, otherwise I would think people would skip them.  But again, I'm just a single Dominican guy. :-)

However, we should have a beginner's or perhaps a D-QandA, where programming questions are post.  Just a thought...

jic

Georg Wrede says...
>
>I can't handle this volume any more.
>
>I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!
>
>
>I'd now have to have TWO laptops, side by side, just to see the threads. By the time I need a third, I'll have to give up entirely.
>
>And to get any kind of overview, even of a single thread, I need two laptops vertically.
>
>That's four laptops total.
>
>
>
>I don't care how ingenious, or how stupid the split is! Just any, whatever!
>
>We (i.e. others than Walter and Matthew) can't read everything, and the way things are, what never gets read becomes increasingly random.
>
>For example, I've now 425 unread posts. If I do any replies (that are worth something, i.e. I need to think what I write) while trying to catch up, I can only see the unreads growing and growing and growing.
>
>How the hell am I supposed to start working on the meta thing, if my entire time goes to reading???
>
>
>
>##############################################
>
>Damn it! There are so many ways to split! Please, choose one if you're out of ideas:
>
>   help
>   suggestions
>   ramblig
>   serious
>
>or
>
>   newbies
>   non-newbie-problems
>   packaging
>   language-discussion
>   ideas
>   other
>
>or
>
>   newbie-help
>   serious-proposals
>   bar-room-pseudo-philosophising
>   other-bandwidth-littering
>   intellectual-duels
>   proper-discussion
>
>or
>
>   threads-started-by-authors-A..M
>   threads-started-by-authors-N..Z
>   threads-started-by-Walter
>
>or
>
>   threads-started-in-a-whim
>   threads-started-just-because-im-bored
>   threads-started-to-show-off
>   threads-started-to-pick-on-D-or-Walter
>   threads-started-because-im-frustrated-on-d-or-my-wife
>   threads-which-should-not-even-have-been-started
>   other-hopefully-this-is-worth-reading
>
>WHAT-CRAPPIN-EVER! But please, do something, now.
>Pretty please!
>
>--------------------------------------------
>
>Aw,what the heck, maybe I'll just skip this all for three weeks, till I've created an AI filter into my newsreader.
>
>Sigh.


March 13, 2005
Georg Wrede wrote:
> I can't handle this volume any more.
> 
> I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!

I've been thinking the same thing for a few days, but I've been afraid to say it. The potential problem is (as always) that it may be difficult to get the messages corralled into the new groups in a consistent manner (especially if the purposes of the groups aren't well-established).

Here's my suggestion for the post-split groups:

dm.D
* Newbies
* General D philosophy
* "Hi, nice to meet you."
* Anything else that doesn't fit into one of the groups below.

dm.D.announce
* Announce new websites, new projects, new builds of existing projects, etc.
* Completely [Off Topic] threads.

dm.D.existential
* Only experts get to start threads.
* Discuss things that people who had followed the D newsgroup for a while have probably already noticed (but need to be discussed again)
* Discuss internal compiler/library matters ("Why is object.printf still there?").

dm.D.features
* Ask for something new (that someone else probably requested 6 months ago).
* Ask for a changed feature (that someone else probably requested 2 years ago).
* Ask for semi-colons to be optional.

-- 
Justin (a/k/a jcc7)
http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/
March 14, 2005
J C Calvarese wrote:
> Georg Wrede wrote:
> 
>> I can't handle this volume any more.
>>
>> I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!
> 
> 
> I've been thinking the same thing for a few days, but I've been afraid to say it. 

You ain't alone!! I bet a few others feel like it too!

ONE THING we could achieve with a split (be it whatever) is that the threads would hopefully get shorter, or not at least as deep!

TODAY, when somebody gets a good idea, it might be right in a deep thread. As there "is only one" thread, nobody is motivated to check whether this new idea would belong somewhere. Then they just blurt their idea in that thread, causing potentially lots of readers to miss the post, since they've skipped the entire thread in an attempt to prune _something_!

So, the mere existence of choice for postings, will cause people to _think_ where to post. Ultimately, even make it more likely to start a new thread, at the very least.
March 14, 2005
> And that's why I have catchy subjects, otherwise I would
> think people would skip them.  But again, I'm just a single Dominican guy.
:-)

You do have catchy subjects ;).



"jicman" <jicman_member@pathlink.com> wrote in message news:d11ehf$23nk$1@digitaldaemon.com...
>
> What happened to "...we are the world, we are the children.  We are the
one to
> make a brighter new day, so let's start giving..."  You know, "there's a
choice
> we're making.  We're saving our own lives.  It's true!  We'll make a
better day
> just you and me."  Well, something like that.  I'm sorry.  I couldn't
resits.
> If you all read every posts, dang, I'm in the wrong place.  I look at the
title
> and I say, "hhmmmm, not interested... mmmmmm, nope.... hmmmmm, what's
this?  Let
> me check it out."  And that's why I have catchy subjects, otherwise I
would
> think people would skip them.  But again, I'm just a single Dominican guy.
:-)
>
> However, we should have a beginner's or perhaps a D-QandA, where
programming
> questions are post.  Just a thought...
>
> jic
>
> Georg Wrede says...
> >
> >I can't handle this volume any more.
> >
> >I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!
> >
> >
> >I'd now have to have TWO laptops, side by side, just to see the threads. By the time I need a third, I'll have to give up entirely.
> >
> >And to get any kind of overview, even of a single thread, I need two laptops vertically.
> >
> >That's four laptops total.
> >
> >
> >
> >I don't care how ingenious, or how stupid the split is! Just any, whatever!
> >
> >We (i.e. others than Walter and Matthew) can't read everything, and the way things are, what never gets read becomes increasingly random.
> >
> >For example, I've now 425 unread posts. If I do any replies (that are worth something, i.e. I need to think what I write) while trying to catch up, I can only see the unreads growing and growing and growing.
> >
> >How the hell am I supposed to start working on the meta thing, if my entire time goes to reading???
> >
> >
> >
> >##############################################
> >
> >Damn it! There are so many ways to split! Please, choose one if you're out of ideas:
> >
> >   help
> >   suggestions
> >   ramblig
> >   serious
> >
> >or
> >
> >   newbies
> >   non-newbie-problems
> >   packaging
> >   language-discussion
> >   ideas
> >   other
> >
> >or
> >
> >   newbie-help
> >   serious-proposals
> >   bar-room-pseudo-philosophising
> >   other-bandwidth-littering
> >   intellectual-duels
> >   proper-discussion
> >
> >or
> >
> >   threads-started-by-authors-A..M
> >   threads-started-by-authors-N..Z
> >   threads-started-by-Walter
> >
> >or
> >
> >   threads-started-in-a-whim
> >   threads-started-just-because-im-bored
> >   threads-started-to-show-off
> >   threads-started-to-pick-on-D-or-Walter
> >   threads-started-because-im-frustrated-on-d-or-my-wife
> >   threads-which-should-not-even-have-been-started
> >   other-hopefully-this-is-worth-reading
> >
> >WHAT-CRAPPIN-EVER! But please, do something, now.
> >Pretty please!
> >
> >--------------------------------------------
> >
> >Aw,what the heck, maybe I'll just skip this all for three weeks, till I've created an AI filter into my newsreader.
> >
> >Sigh.
>
>


March 14, 2005
"Georg Wrede" <georg.wrede@nospam.org> wrote in message news:42340432.4010404@nospam.org...
>I can't handle this volume any more.
>
> I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!

A superficial split wouldn't hurt for things like announcements or whatever. But I think the real "problem" is that lots of discussion is going on.  I think it will die back down once ideas (and tempers) have calmed down.

If you want to help to that end, maybe you can have a poll to capture people's feelings about the main issues, or something.


March 14, 2005
On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:48:01 -0500, Charlie Patterson wrote:

> "Georg Wrede" <georg.wrede@nospam.org> wrote in message news:42340432.4010404@nospam.org...
>>I can't handle this volume any more.
>>
>> I don't care how this newsgroup is split, but something has to be done!
> 
> A superficial split wouldn't hurt for things like announcements or whatever. But I think the real "problem" is that lots of discussion is going on.  I think it will die back down once ideas (and tempers) have calmed down.
> 
> If you want to help to that end, maybe you can have a poll to capture people's feelings about the main issues, or something.

I think you are right, Charlie. I suspect that with more groups, you will just get more misplaced discussions.

-- 
Derek
Melbourne, Australia
15/03/2005 10:37:01 AM
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