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April 15, 2007
Re: Time to do a Man's Work ??
Carlos Santander wrote:
> Walter Bright escribió:
>> Carlos Santander wrote:
>>> Walter Bright escribió:
>>>> True, but there's another factor as well - the ability to work with 
>>>> people face to face. That's why we're having the D conference in 
>>>> August. I hope to be able to meet as many of you as possible then.
>>>
>>> First half of August, I hope? Anything after the 23rd would conflict 
>>> with school, and perhaps I'm not the only one in that situation.
>>
>> End of August. Brad Roberts is organizing it.
> 
> That's going to be a problem, I guess. Anyway, long time to go, yet, so 
> let's see how things pan out.

I don't think there's any time that's good for everyone.  I have some 
academic commitments that don't end until mid-late august, for example.


Sean
April 15, 2007
Re: Time to do a Man's Work ??
Sean Kelly escribió:
> Carlos Santander wrote:
>> Walter Bright escribió:
>>> Carlos Santander wrote:
>>>> Walter Bright escribió:
>>>>> True, but there's another factor as well - the ability to work with 
>>>>> people face to face. That's why we're having the D conference in 
>>>>> August. I hope to be able to meet as many of you as possible then.
>>>>
>>>> First half of August, I hope? Anything after the 23rd would conflict 
>>>> with school, and perhaps I'm not the only one in that situation.
>>>
>>> End of August. Brad Roberts is organizing it.
>>
>> That's going to be a problem, I guess. Anyway, long time to go, yet, 
>> so let's see how things pan out.
> 
> I don't think there's any time that's good for everyone.  I have some 
> academic commitments that don't end until mid-late august, for example.
> 
> 
> Sean

Right. At the end, a date has to be picked and those can go, go.

-- 
Carlos Santander Bernal
April 15, 2007
Re: Time to do a Man's Work ??
What?? That previous discussion was bad enough that it drove Andrei 
away? That's unfortunate :/ .  I hope it's only temporary.


James Dennett wrote:
> Sean Kelly wrote:
>> David B. Held wrote:
>>> Perhaps there is a small element of personality cult involved, and I
>>> think Andrei is popular partly because he is a personable and
>>> entertaining guy at times.  He has strong views on many topics and
>>> defends those views vigorously.
>> To everyone but us, it seems.  I'll admit I'm more than a bit
>> disappointed that Andrei gave up on public discussions of D.
> 
> There's a distinction that seems key for constructive
> discussion, that does not seem important to some here:
> the difference between attacking/defending our technical
> creations, and attacking/defending the people involved.
> 

Indeed. And we are software engineers*, we should know better than the 
average person how to not only to detect the difference, but to 
*abstract* one thing from another. (this was actually one of the points 
covered in that Google presentation I mentioned recently) It seems thats 
not the case, as emotionality still takes over rationality for many 
people, even "smart" people.

* (developers, coders, hackers, whatever)

-- 
Bruno Medeiros - MSc in CS/E student
http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?BrunoMedeiros#D
April 17, 2007
Re: Time to do a Man's Work ??
Op Sat, 14 Apr 2007 10:07:09 -0700
schreef "David B. Held" <dheld@codelogicconsulting.com>:

> That's true, but Andrei was expecting the civility of a moderated
> group, where flame wars and personal attacks are stopped before they
> are started.

A flamewar between 2 (groups of) people stops when 1 (one) side stops
replying...   ;-)


-- 
JanC
April 19, 2007
Re: Time to do a Man's Work ??
Jan Claeys wrote:
> Op Sat, 14 Apr 2007 10:07:09 -0700
> schreef "David B. Held" <dheld@codelogicconsulting.com>:
> 
>> That's true, but Andrei was expecting the civility of a moderated
>> group, where flame wars and personal attacks are stopped before they
>> are started.
> 
> A flamewar between 2 (groups of) people stops when 1 (one) side stops
> replying...   ;-)

Ending a flamewar is fundamentally different from not getting sucked 
into one (and exponentially harder, I might add).  That's why it's much 
cheaper to not start them.  Ever tried to put out a phosphorus fire?

Dave
April 27, 2007
Re: Time to do a Man's Work ??
Mr. Wrede,
I will just add that is it absolutely impossible to satisfy everybody, especially with design of some piece of software. People have different taste, and different level of tolerance, and it also happens that at some point in tome that levels goes down for some reasons. This is part of being human. :)
Software engineers are quite known to be very "touchy" when someone criticises their work - and quite often they take it offensive, disrespectfull, etc. They usually tend to say "i have spent years on this, how could (s)he say such and such, how disrespectful, ..." - without any intention to do some kind of analyze of their own work when someone points out to some problems.

From my experience, it is the best to simply stop discussion when it becomes "hot" - exactly what Andrei did.
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