Hello,


Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.

Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.

What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.

Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?


Thanks,

Andrei

Absolutely!

I think this is exactly what we would want: http://www.trello.com

Regards,
Alex

On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 4:19 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu <andrei at erdani.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
>
> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.
>
> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
>
> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.
>
> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Andrei
> _______________________________________________
> dmd-internals mailing list
> dmd-internals at puremagic.com
> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/dmd-internals

I'm a fan of Redmine (http://redmine.org). It's quite similar to Trac.

Some stuff that might be interesting:
* Roadmap/goals
* Multiple projects
* Mail support (create/comment on tickets etc. by email)
* Wiki
* Source code support (close tickets by repository comments etc)

I don't know of any good hosting provider for redmine though.

On 17.01.2012 16:19, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
> Hello,
>
>
> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.
>
> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
>
> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.
>
> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Andrei
> _______________________________________________
> phobos mailing list
> phobos at puremagic.com
> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos

I had the impression Redmine is more of a replacement for Bugzilla though?

BTW, there's also: http://www.asana.com (Personally I prefer Trello to
Asana though)

Regards,
Alex

On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 5:42 PM, Simen Endsj? <simendsjo at gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm a fan of Redmine (http://redmine.org). It's quite similar to Trac.
>
> Some stuff that might be interesting:
> * Roadmap/goals
> * Multiple projects
> * Mail support (create/comment on tickets etc. by email)
> * Wiki
> * Source code support (close tickets by repository comments etc)
>
> I don't know of any good hosting provider for redmine though.
>
>
> On 17.01.2012 16:19, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.
>>
>> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
>>
>> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.
>>
>> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Andrei
>> _______________________________________________
>> phobos mailing list
>> phobos at puremagic.com
>> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> phobos mailing list
> phobos at puremagic.com
> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos

On 1/17/2012 7:19 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> 
> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.
> 
> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
> 
> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.
> 
> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Andrei

IMHO, we've got plenty of tools in our mix we just don't use them well.

Bugzilla already has several dimensions of scheduling, including severity, priority, and milestones.  Additionally, it's probably way overdue to apply more structure to the products/components.  I know it's something Don has advocated before.

Wiki is a good document collaboration tool.

The DLang website is a good communication tool, as are the newsgroups/mailing lists.

Between bugzilla for fine grained categorization of issues/enhancements/whatever and a page on the website to state high level goals, I'm not sure what else we really need.

I absolutely agree that we need to have a better roadmap and to execute on it, just not that another tool is needed or useful.

My 2 cents,
Brad

I'd just like to add to that, that the Bugzilla voting system should actually be paid attention to. It's largely ignored right now.

Regards,
Alex

On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 6:34 PM, Brad Roberts <braddr at puremagic.com> wrote:
> On 1/17/2012 7:19 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.
>>
>> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
>>
>> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.
>>
>> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Andrei
>
> IMHO, we've got plenty of tools in our mix we just don't use them well.
>
> Bugzilla already has several dimensions of scheduling, including severity, priority, and milestones. ?Additionally, it's probably way overdue to apply more structure to the products/components. ?I know it's something Don has advocated before.
>
> Wiki is a good document collaboration tool.
>
> The DLang website is a good communication tool, as are the newsgroups/mailing lists.
>
> Between bugzilla for fine grained categorization of issues/enhancements/whatever and a page on the website to state high level goals, I'm not sure what else we really need.
>
> I absolutely agree that we need to have a better roadmap and to execute on it, just not that another tool is needed or useful.
>
> My 2 cents,
> Brad
> _______________________________________________
> phobos mailing list
> phobos at puremagic.com
> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos

Yeah, I argued against turning it on if we weren't going to use it.. and I was fairly sure it would be ignored.  Heck, even severity is largely ignored.

On Tue, 17 Jan 2012, Alex wrote:

> I'd just like to add to that, that the Bugzilla voting system should actually be paid attention to. It's largely ignored right now.
> 
> Regards,
> Alex
> 
> On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 6:34 PM, Brad Roberts <braddr at puremagic.com> wrote:
> > On 1/17/2012 7:19 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
> >> Hello,
> >>
> >>
> >> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.
> >>
> >> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
> >>
> >> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.
> >>
> >> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> Andrei
> >
> > IMHO, we've got plenty of tools in our mix we just don't use them well.
> >
> > Bugzilla already has several dimensions of scheduling, including severity, priority, and milestones. ?Additionally, it's probably way overdue to apply more structure to the products/components. ?I know it's something Don has advocated before.
> >
> > Wiki is a good document collaboration tool.
> >
> > The DLang website is a good communication tool, as are the newsgroups/mailing lists.
> >
> > Between bugzilla for fine grained categorization of issues/enhancements/whatever and a page on the website to state high level goals, I'm not sure what else we really need.
> >
> > I absolutely agree that we need to have a better roadmap and to execute on it, just not that another tool is needed or useful.
> >
> > My 2 cents,
> > Brad
> > _______________________________________________
> > phobos mailing list
> > phobos at puremagic.com
> > http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
> _______________________________________________
> phobos mailing list
> phobos at puremagic.com
> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
> 

I recall Don is very organized about watching and acting on the votes. My opinion is (as I mentioned a while ago) that the 5/person vote limit prevents good statistical effects from happening.

Andrei

On 1/17/12 12:39 PM, Brad Roberts wrote:
> Yeah, I argued against turning it on if we weren't going to use it.. and I was fairly sure it would be ignored.  Heck, even severity is largely ignored.
>
> On Tue, 17 Jan 2012, Alex wrote:
>
>> I'd just like to add to that, that the Bugzilla voting system should actually be paid attention to. It's largely ignored right now.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Alex
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 6:34 PM, Brad Roberts<braddr at puremagic.com>  wrote:
>>> On 1/17/2012 7:19 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks, goals, and milestones.
>>>>
>>>> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs and small enhancement requests. Then we have github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
>>>>
>>>> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us make plans together, order work items by urgency and importance, and share with the community what our goals and milestones are.
>>>>
>>>> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you know of such a tool?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Andrei
>>>
>>> IMHO, we've got plenty of tools in our mix we just don't use them well.
>>>
>>> Bugzilla already has several dimensions of scheduling, including severity, priority, and milestones.  Additionally, it's probably way overdue to apply more structure to the products/components.  I know it's something Don has advocated before.
>>>
>>> Wiki is a good document collaboration tool.
>>>
>>> The DLang website is a good communication tool, as are the newsgroups/mailing lists.
>>>
>>> Between bugzilla for fine grained categorization of issues/enhancements/whatever and a page on the website to state high level goals, I'm not sure what else we really need.
>>>
>>> I absolutely agree that we need to have a better roadmap and to execute on it, just not that another tool is needed or useful.
>>>
>>> My 2 cents,
>>> Brad
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> phobos mailing list
>>> phobos at puremagic.com
>>> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
>> _______________________________________________
>> phobos mailing list
>> phobos at puremagic.com
>> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> phobos mailing list
>> phobos at puremagic.com
>> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos

The number is irrelevant if the results aren't consulted.  What was the last time you looked at the stack ranking of votes?  What was the last time you used it when deciding on what issue(s) to address?

If you can't remember off the top of your head without having to think about it, I rest my case.

On Tue, 17 Jan 2012, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

> Date: Tue, 17 Jan 2012 12:41:03 -0600
> From: Andrei Alexandrescu <andrei at erdani.com>
> To: Discuss the phobos library for D <phobos at puremagic.com>
> Cc: Brad Roberts <braddr at puremagic.com>
> Subject: Re: [phobos] [dmd-internals] Planning software?
> 
> I recall Don is very organized about watching and acting on the votes. My opinion is (as I mentioned a while ago) that the 5/person vote limit prevents good statistical effects from happening.
> 
> Andrei
> 
> On 1/17/12 12:39 PM, Brad Roberts wrote:
> > Yeah, I argued against turning it on if we weren't going to use it.. and I was fairly sure it would be ignored.  Heck, even severity is largely ignored.
> > 
> > On Tue, 17 Jan 2012, Alex wrote:
> > 
> > > I'd just like to add to that, that the Bugzilla voting system should actually be paid attention to. It's largely ignored right now.
> > > 
> > > Regards,
> > > Alex
> > > 
> > > On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 6:34 PM, Brad Roberts<braddr at puremagic.com> wrote:
> > > > On 1/17/2012 7:19 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
> > > > > Hello,
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning
> > > > > software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks,
> > > > > goals, and milestones.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs
> > > > > and small enhancement requests. Then we have
> > > > > github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
> > > > > 
> > > > > What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us
> > > > > make plans together, order work items by urgency
> > > > > and importance, and share with the community what our goals and
> > > > > milestones are.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually
> > > > > helps us? And, before I start asking around, do you
> > > > > know of such a tool?
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > 
> > > > > Andrei
> > > > 
> > > > IMHO, we've got plenty of tools in our mix we just don't use them well.
> > > > 
> > > > Bugzilla already has several dimensions of scheduling, including
> > > > severity, priority, and milestones.  Additionally, it's
> > > > probably way overdue to apply more structure to the products/components.
> > > > I know it's something Don has advocated before.
> > > > 
> > > > Wiki is a good document collaboration tool.
> > > > 
> > > > The DLang website is a good communication tool, as are the newsgroups/mailing lists.
> > > > 
> > > > Between bugzilla for fine grained categorization of issues/enhancements/whatever and a page on the website to state high level goals, I'm not sure what else we really need.
> > > > 
> > > > I absolutely agree that we need to have a better roadmap and to execute
> > > > on it, just not that another tool is needed or
> > > > useful.
> > > > 
> > > > My 2 cents,
> > > > Brad
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > phobos mailing list
> > > > phobos at puremagic.com
> > > > http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > phobos mailing list
> > > phobos at puremagic.com
> > > http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
> > > 
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > phobos mailing list
> > > phobos at puremagic.com
> > > http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos
> 

On Tue, 17 Jan 2012 18:34:32 +0100, Brad Roberts <braddr at puremagic.com> wrote:

> On 1/17/2012 7:19 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> Walter and I were thinking of considering a sort of project planning
>> software, i.e. one that tracks high-level tasks,
>> goals, and milestones.
>>
>> Currently we have bugzilla for issue tracking, which is good for bugs
>> and small enhancement requests. Then we have
>> github which is excellent for revision tracking and such.
>>
>> What we currently lack is a sort of a higher level tool that helps us
>> make plans together, order work items by urgency
>> and importance, and share with the community what our goals and
>> milestones are.
>>
>> Would you want to use such a tool, assuming of course it actually helps
>> us? And, before I start asking around, do you
>> know of such a tool?
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Andrei
>
> IMHO, we've got plenty of tools in our mix we just don't use them well.
>
> Bugzilla already has several dimensions of scheduling, including
> severity, priority, and milestones.  Additionally, it's
> probably way overdue to apply more structure to the
> products/components.  I know it's something Don has advocated before.
>
> Wiki is a good document collaboration tool.
>
> The DLang website is a good communication tool, as are the newsgroups/mailing lists.
>
> Between bugzilla for fine grained categorization of issues/enhancements/whatever and a page on the website to state high level goals, I'm not sure what else we really need.
>
> I absolutely agree that we need to have a better roadmap and to execute
> on it, just not that another tool is needed or
> useful.
>
> My 2 cents,
> Brad
> _______________________________________________
> phobos mailing list
> phobos at puremagic.com
> http://lists.puremagic.com/mailman/listinfo/phobos

While Bugzilla is good at archiving bugs it fails to provide overview.

I don't advocate to use github's issue tracker but
they have a superb integration of issues and milestones.

https://github.com/mxcl/homebrew/issues/milestones https://github.com/mxcl/homebrew/issues https://github.com/blog/831-issues-2-0-the-next-generation

If we could get closer to this with Bugzilla that should suffice.