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May 09, 2006
new domain: d-programming-language.org
I've just registered it, so it can be the 'official' D site.

1) Why so long?

Because "D" is un-googlable, there needs to be a reasonably unique, 
recognizable phrase for it. Nothing works as well as "d programming 
language". There's no ambiguity about what it's about. Besides, most 
people will get to the web site via a click, rather than typing it in.


2) Why the embedded '-'?

In my experiments, google doesn't separate dprogramminglanguage into 3 
words. But it will if there are embedded '-'s.


3) Why 'org' instead of 'com'?

Because the D language itself is not a company, nor is it a proprietary 
language. Hence, 'org' is the most appropriate for it.


4) When will it go live?

It'll take a couple days at least.
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
In article <e3osei$g90$1@digitaldaemon.com>, Walter Bright says...
>
>I've just registered it, so it can be the 'official' D site.
>

In my opinion, typeability is as or more important than googleability.
d-programming-language.org is difficult to type (both because of the length and
because of the dashes)

Plus, google parses -'s as a word separator, so "d-programming-language" would
match "d-programming langugae", "d programming-language", "d programming
language", "D) Programming languages", etc, and more importantly,
d-programming-language (no quotes) would match , "a b c d e f g ... programming
is the act of writing data in a language suitable for a computer to interpret"

- Gregor Richards
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
On Mon, 08 May 2006 21:49:09 -0400, Walter Bright  
<newshound@digitalmars.com> wrote:

> I've just registered it, so it can be the 'official' D site.
>
> 1) Why so long?
>
> Because "D" is un-googlable, there needs to be a reasonably unique,  
> recognizable phrase for it. Nothing works as well as "d programming  
> language". There's no ambiguity about what it's about. Besides, most  
> people will get to the web site via a click, rather than typing it in.

I got a cramp typing it, and aggrivated trying to tell my friend.  </joke>

>
> 2) Why the embedded '-'?
>
> In my experiments, google doesn't separate dprogramminglanguage into 3  
> words. But it will if there are embedded '-'s.

In my experiments, Google DOES separate DOMAINS.  </fact>

>
> 3) Why 'org' instead of 'com'?
>
> Because the D language itself is not a company, nor is it a proprietary  
> language. Hence, 'org' is the most appropriate for it.

I guess that's fine.

>
> 4) When will it go live?
>
> It'll take a couple days at least.

I can't wait, or, I can...


Why not get  
d--the-programming-language-of-the-future-with-cool-features.organization  
instead? No chance of misunderstanding.  </sarcasm>

So, as you can gather, I think it's a terrible, terrible choice.

At the very least you could have 2 domains (or more); this one could be  
advertised, and the other could be the brief and pretty one for practical  
use.

- Chris
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
Sorry about that unfriendly post. I'll try to explain better.

Google and yahoo search both treat domains with '-' less because they're  
most likely spam domains. '-' does pretty much no good, and is harder to  
tell people the site vocally due to having to explain the dashes, and  
makes it overall sound less appealing.
Notice that when you google for `d programming` it bolds the whole,  
non-'.com' part of dprogramming.com because it does do substring searches  
on domains.

The other issue is that it's just too long, even without the dashes. I  
wouldn't be surprised if search engines give lower priority to domains  
that long as well.

digitalmars.com and dprogramming.com are fairly long, but they don't  
exactly go over that "too far" limit like d-programming-language.org does.

My suggestion is to get dlanguage.org, and also get dlanguage.com to  
redirect to dlanguage.org.
There are different reasons for also getting the .com version: many people  
try .com first; domain squatters watch for .org registrations and hurry up  
and grab the .com counterparts for spam sometimes; and .com hasn't  
completely meant 'commercial' for years now, some users even don't know it  
or assume it means 'computer'.

- Chris
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
Chris Miller wrote:
> Sorry about that unfriendly post. I'll try to explain better.
> 
> Google and yahoo search both treat domains with '-' less because they're 
> most likely spam domains. '-' does pretty much no good, and is harder to 
> tell people the site vocally due to having to explain the dashes, and 
> makes it overall sound less appealing.
> Notice that when you google for `d programming` it bolds the whole, 
> non-'.com' part of dprogramming.com because it does do substring 
> searches on domains.
> 
> The other issue is that it's just too long, even without the dashes. I 
> wouldn't be surprised if search engines give lower priority to domains 
> that long as well.
> 
> digitalmars.com and dprogramming.com are fairly long, but they don't 
> exactly go over that "too far" limit like d-programming-language.org does.
> 
> My suggestion is to get dlanguage.org, and also get dlanguage.com to 
> redirect to dlanguage.org.
> There are different reasons for also getting the .com version: many 
> people try .com first; domain squatters watch for .org registrations and 
> hurry up and grab the .com counterparts for spam sometimes; and .com 
> hasn't completely meant 'commercial' for years now, some users even 
> don't know it or assume it means 'computer'.
> 
> - Chris


I agree with Chris and Gregor that the site name is awfully unwieldy. 
dlanguage.org (and com) would be a great choice... Yet I /do/ think the 
"org" post-fix is to be preferred; and I do think it makes a big 
difference to people visiting the site, although I agree that snapping 
up the same *.com address would be a good idea as well.  Whenever I 
visit *.com sites, I always assume a proprietary nature, even though it 
probably qualifies as a knee-jerk reaction.

Nevertheless, I applaud Walter on this step.  I am very happy to see 
he's working towards publicizing D in this way.  It's an important move, 
I think.

-JJR
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
Chris Miller wrote:
> Sorry about that unfriendly post. I'll try to explain better.
> 
> Google and yahoo search both treat domains with '-' less because they're 
> most likely spam domains. '-' does pretty much no good, and is harder to 
> tell people the site vocally due to having to explain the dashes, and 
> makes it overall sound less appealing.
> Notice that when you google for `d programming` it bolds the whole, 
> non-'.com' part of dprogramming.com because it does do substring 
> searches on domains.
> 
> The other issue is that it's just too long, even without the dashes. I 
> wouldn't be surprised if search engines give lower priority to domains 
> that long as well.
> 
> digitalmars.com and dprogramming.com are fairly long, but they don't 
> exactly go over that "too far" limit like d-programming-language.org does.
> 
> My suggestion is to get dlanguage.org, and also get dlanguage.com to 
> redirect to dlanguage.org.
> There are different reasons for also getting the .com version: many 
> people try .com first; domain squatters watch for .org registrations and 
> hurry up and grab the .com counterparts for spam sometimes; and .com 
> hasn't completely meant 'commercial' for years now, some users even 
> don't know it or assume it means 'computer'.
> 
> - Chris

I am of the same mind with the previous posters. I am extremely excited 
however with the direction you are going, Walter. Perhaps if the domain 
hasn't been registered yet, we can discuss this further. If not, I'm 
still very excited with this decision.

-- 
Kyle Furlong // Physics Undergrad, UCSB

"D is going wherever the D community wants it to go." - Walter Bright
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
Gregor Richards wrote:
> In article <e3osei$g90$1@digitaldaemon.com>, Walter Bright says...
>> I've just registered it, so it can be the 'official' D site.
>>
> 
> In my opinion, typeability is as or more important than googleability.
> d-programming-language.org is difficult to type (both because of the length and
> because of the dashes)

Which is why I agonized over this for quite a while. But the usage 
statistics from the web log show that the overwhelming amount of traffic 
comes to the digitalmars site via clicking on links, usually from 
google. Heck, even I click to get to digitalmars.com rather than typing 
it in!


> Plus, google parses -'s as a word separator, so "d-programming-language" would
> match "d-programming langugae", "d programming-language", "d programming
> language", "D) Programming languages", etc,

Yes, and most importantly, it will match "d programming language" which 
is what we should be building brand around, and that match will place 
high (if not first) in the search results for that phrase.

> and more importantly,
> d-programming-language (no quotes) would match , "a b c d e f g ... programming
> is the act of writing data in a language suitable for a computer to interpret"

It'd probably be down in the results for that.
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
Chris Miller wrote:
> At the very least you could have 2 domains (or more); this one could be 
> advertised, and the other could be the brief and pretty one for 
> practical use.

There are no brief, pretty, available, and relevant names that I can find.
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
Walter Bright wrote:
> I've just registered it, so it can be the 'official' D site.
> 
> 1) Why so long?
> 
> Because "D" is un-googlable, there needs to be a reasonably unique, 
> recognizable phrase for it. Nothing works as well as "d programming 
> language". There's no ambiguity about what it's about. Besides, most 
> people will get to the web site via a click, rather than typing it in.
> 
> 
> 2) Why the embedded '-'?
> 
> In my experiments, google doesn't separate dprogramminglanguage into 3 
> words. But it will if there are embedded '-'s.
> 
> 
> 3) Why 'org' instead of 'com'?
> 
> Because the D language itself is not a company, nor is it a proprietary 
> language. Hence, 'org' is the most appropriate for it.
> 
> 
> 4) When will it go live?
> 
> It'll take a couple days at least.

This is a great step forward, I'm looking forward for the site to go live!

But, I have to agree with the others who posted before me. The domain 
name choice is not very good.
I would prefer something along the lines of dlangauge.org or dlang.org
May 09, 2006
Re: new domain: d-programming-language.org
Walter Bright wrote:
> Gregor Richards wrote:
> 
[snip]
> 
>> and more importantly,
>> d-programming-language (no quotes) would match , "a b c d e f g ... 
>> programming
>> is the act of writing data in a language suitable for a computer to 
>> interpret"
> 
> 
> It'd probably be down in the results for that.
> 

Maybe msn search would put that on the top :lol:
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