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July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
Jarrett Billingsley wrote:
> "Craig Black" <craigblack2@cox.net> wrote in message 
> news:g6ba04$1pfb$1@digitalmars.com...
>> "Walter Bright" <newshound1@digitalmars.com> wrote in message 
>> news:g6b1ae$up4$1@digitalmars.com...
>>> http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
>>>
>>> and of course on reddit:
>>>
>>> http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
>> Very cool stuff.  So is a future version of D going to use thin locks when 
>> the synchronize keyword is used?
>>
>> -Craig
> 
> It's something that's part of the runtime lib.  I think they can be 
> implemented in Tango already.  I'm not sure how robust Phobos is in terms of 
> monitor flexibility. 

From what I understand, it's being redesigned to work a lot like Tango.


Sean
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
Lionello Lunesu wrote:
> 
> "Walter Bright" <newshound1@digitalmars.com> wrote in message 
> news:g6b1ae$up4$1@digitalmars.com...
>> http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
>>
>> and of course on reddit:
>>
>> http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
> 
> I remember reading somewhere that critical-sections on Windows do just 
> that.

They pretty much do.  And futexes are largely the same thing in Linux.


Sean
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
Sean Kelly:
>  From what I understand, it's being redesigned to work a lot like Tango.

Ah, I see, the start of a convergence :-)
Is Phobos going to gain an actor-based concurrency module, beside the current threading module?

Bye,
bearophile
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
Walter Bright wrote:
> superdan wrote:
>> Walter Bright Wrote:
>>
>>> http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
>>>
>>> and of course on reddit:
>>>
>>> http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
>>
>> very cool stuff that's gonna cross the t in threads for d. i'm so
>> very glad bartosz is on team. would he join the newsgroup, or is he a
>> mimosa as well?
> 
> We are very lucky to have Bartosz working with us. He's an expert on 
> multithreaded programming, and even better, he spends a lot of time 
> researching the latest in what others are doing so that D will build on 
> best practices rather than reinvent mistakes.

That's really cool.  How long has Bartosz been working with you?  You've 
always said that multithreading is not your strongest point.  Its great 
to have someone on your team with that sort of experience.

-Joel
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
Sean Kelly, el 24 de julio a las 23:09 me escribiste:
> Lionello Lunesu wrote:
> >"Walter Bright" <newshound1@digitalmars.com> wrote in message 
> >news:g6b1ae$up4$1@digitalmars.com...
> >>http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
> >>
> >>and of course on reddit:
> >>
> >>http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
> >I remember reading somewhere that critical-sections on Windows do just that.
> 
> They pretty much do.  And futexes are largely the same thing in Linux.

So, why D must reinvent the wheel, duplicating a well known technique done
in most modern OS? This will only add overhead to D.

Please, at least make it conditional only to OSs that don't provide this
optimization by themselves.

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (luca) | Blog colectivo: http://www.mazziblog.com.ar/blog/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
GPG Key: 5F5A8D05 (F8CD F9A7 BF00 5431 4145  104C 949E BFB6 5F5A 8D05)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Lidiar" no es lo mismo que "holguear"; ya que "lidiar" es relativo a
"lidia" y "holguear" es relativo a "olga".
	-- Ricardo Vaporeso
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
JAnderson Wrote:

> Walter Bright wrote:
> > superdan wrote:
> >> Walter Bright Wrote:
> >>
> >>> http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
> >>>
> >>> and of course on reddit:
> >>>
> >>> http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
> >>
> >> very cool stuff that's gonna cross the t in threads for d. i'm so
> >> very glad bartosz is on team. would he join the newsgroup, or is he a
> >> mimosa as well?
> > 
> > We are very lucky to have Bartosz working with us. He's an expert on 
> > multithreaded programming, and even better, he spends a lot of time 
> > researching the latest in what others are doing so that D will build on 
> > best practices rather than reinvent mistakes.
> 
> That's really cool.  How long has Bartosz been working with you?  You've 
> always said that multithreading is not your strongest point.  Its great 
> to have someone on your team with that sort of experience.
> 
> -Joel

judging by his articles andrei also knows his shit. walter seems to have his ass covered. so walter - any word on a true multiprocessing model for d coming soon? u understand it's expected to be better than java's or c++'s.
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
Leandro Lucarella Wrote:

> Sean Kelly, el 24 de julio a las 23:09 me escribiste:
> > Lionello Lunesu wrote:
> > >"Walter Bright" <newshound1@digitalmars.com> wrote in message 
> > >news:g6b1ae$up4$1@digitalmars.com...
> > >>http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
> > >>
> > >>and of course on reddit:
> > >>
> > >>http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
> > >I remember reading somewhere that critical-sections on Windows do just that.
> > 
> > They pretty much do.  And futexes are largely the same thing in Linux.
> 
> So, why D must reinvent the wheel, duplicating a well known technique done
> in most modern OS? This will only add overhead to D.
> 
> Please, at least make it conditional only to OSs that don't provide this
> optimization by themselves.

there is no reinvention. the man quotes his sources. at most there is reimplementation. and that's unavoidable as far as i understand. thin locks must be integrated with the object model so they place that word right there and do shit with it.
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
superdan, el 25 de julio a las 13:17 me escribiste:
> Leandro Lucarella Wrote:
> 
> > Sean Kelly, el 24 de julio a las 23:09 me escribiste:
> > > Lionello Lunesu wrote:
> > > >"Walter Bright" <newshound1@digitalmars.com> wrote in message 
> > > >news:g6b1ae$up4$1@digitalmars.com...
> > > >>http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
> > > >>
> > > >>and of course on reddit:
> > > >>
> > > >>http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
> > > >I remember reading somewhere that critical-sections on Windows do just that.
> > > 
> > > They pretty much do.  And futexes are largely the same thing in Linux.
> > 
> > So, why D must reinvent the wheel, duplicating a well known technique done
> > in most modern OS? This will only add overhead to D.
> > 
> > Please, at least make it conditional only to OSs that don't provide this
> > optimization by themselves.
> 
> there is no reinvention. the man quotes his sources. at most there is reimplementation. and that's unavoidable as far as i understand. thin locks must be integrated with the object model so they place that word right there and do shit with it.

Then please don't add this at all! It's a little lame add overhead to all
modern OS just to be a babysitter of poor ones.

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (luca) | Blog colectivo: http://www.mazziblog.com.ar/blog/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
GPG Key: 5F5A8D05 (F8CD F9A7 BF00 5431 4145  104C 949E BFB6 5F5A 8D05)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
41% of all people take people with curly hair less seriously
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
Walter Bright Wrote:

> superdan wrote:
> > Walter Bright Wrote:
> > 
> >> http://bartoszmilewski.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/thin-locks-in-d/
> >> 
> >> and of course on reddit:
> >> 
> >> http://www.reddit.com/comments/6tbzc/thin_locks_in_d/
> > 
> > very cool stuff that's gonna cross the t in threads for d. i'm so
> > very glad bartosz is on team. would he join the newsgroup, or is he a
> > mimosa as well?
> 
> We are very lucky to have Bartosz working with us. He's an expert on 
> multithreaded programming, and even better, he spends a lot of time 
> researching the latest in what others are doing so that D will build on 
> best practices rather than reinvent mistakes.

So, the STM stuff Bartoz was talking about at the conference... is that still
slated for inclusion?
July 25, 2008
Re: Thin Locks in D
superdan wrote:
> judging by his articles andrei also knows his shit. walter seems to
> have his ass covered. so walter - any word on a true multiprocessing
> model for d coming soon? u understand it's expected to be better than
> java's or c++'s.

We hope to have something concrete by September.
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