Steve Teale wrote:
> Walter Bright Wrote:
> 
>> Robert Clipsham wrote:
>>> I'd like to know what you think on each of these matters, and
>>> hopefully inspire us to take some action to make sure D succeeds.
>>> 
>> Pick one of the items you find the most interesting, and work on
>> it!
> 
> Walter,
> 
> But then if you do, my experience is that nobody is interested. OK,
> perhaps I'm writing crap - I'm getting old and outdated, but you
> don't even get told that except by Superdan.
> 
> If someone has done as you suggest, what is the mechanism for moving
> it toward the D mainstream?
> 
> Where do you post it, who do you send it to, who is the judge, and
> where is the verdict posted?
> 
> D should try to avoid being like Iran!

Here's one example Robert mentioned: getting D support into the GDB main source. That doesn't require anything from me or anyone else. It requires someone to doggedly push the changes to the people who control GDB.

It's not a big job - the GDB patches already exist.

http://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=10142

But it's a high leverage issue, meaning it'll be a big win for D's acceptance and credibility.

Walter Bright, el 26 de junio a las 12:30 me escribiste:
> >Where do you post it, who do you send it to, who is the judge, and
> >where is the verdict posted?
> >D should try to avoid being like Iran!
> 
> Here's one example Robert mentioned: getting D support into the GDB main source. That doesn't require anything from me or anyone else. It requires someone to doggedly push the changes to the people who control GDB.
> 
> It's not a big job - the GDB patches already exist.
> 
> http://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=10142
> 
> But it's a high leverage issue, meaning it'll be a big win for D's acceptance and credibility.

I have tried to push the patches on[1], but sadly never got an answer from the original author. Again, some D-related stuff got abandoned, I don't know, maybe D is damned =/

I guess someone has to rewrite those patches to be able to integrate them in GDB (or try harder to find the patches author).

[1] http://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=10142

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (luca) | Blog colectivo: http://www.mazziblog.com.ar/blog/
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- Ser aguja, nada más, y cumplir su misión.
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Leandro Lucarella wrote:
> Walter Bright, el 26 de junio a las 12:30 me escribiste:
>>> Where do you post it, who do you send it to, who is the judge, and
>>> where is the verdict posted?
>>> D should try to avoid being like Iran!
>> Here's one example Robert mentioned: getting D support into the GDB main source. That doesn't require anything from me or anyone else. It requires someone to doggedly push the changes to the people who control GDB.
>>
>> It's not a big job - the GDB patches already exist.
>>
>> http://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=10142
>>
>> But it's a high leverage issue, meaning it'll be a big win for D's
>> acceptance and credibility.
> 
> I have tried to push the patches on[1], but sadly never got an answer from
> the original author. Again, some D-related stuff got abandoned, I don't
> know, maybe D is damned =/
> 
> I guess someone has to rewrite those patches to be able to integrate them
> in GDB (or try harder to find the patches author).
> 
> [1] http://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=10142
> 


The ones less than 10 lines don't need to be rewritten, just the longer ones. It still should be a straightforward job, there isn't that much of it. That's why I suggest it is the ideal project for someone wanting to contribute to D - it's a small project with large positive consequences.

Walter Bright a écrit :
> Leandro Lucarella wrote:
>> Walter Bright, el 26 de junio a las 12:30 me escribiste:
>>>> Where do you post it, who do you send it to, who is the judge, and
>>>> where is the verdict posted?
>>>> D should try to avoid being like Iran!
>>> Here's one example Robert mentioned: getting D support into the GDB main source. That doesn't require anything from me or anyone else. It requires someone to doggedly push the changes to the people who control GDB.
>>>
>>> It's not a big job - the GDB patches already exist.
>>>
>>> http://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=10142
>>>
>>> But it's a high leverage issue, meaning it'll be a big win for D's
>>> acceptance and credibility.
>>
>> I have tried to push the patches on[1], but sadly never got an answer from
>> the original author. Again, some D-related stuff got abandoned, I don't
>> know, maybe D is damned =/
>>
>> I guess someone has to rewrite those patches to be able to integrate them
>> in GDB (or try harder to find the patches author).
>>
>> [1] http://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=10142
>>
> 
> 
> The ones less than 10 lines don't need to be rewritten, just the longer ones. It still should be a straightforward job, there isn't that much of it. That's why I suggest it is the ideal project for someone wanting to contribute to D - it's a small project with large positive consequences.

As long as D language is not available on more platforms it will be a dead language.
It's a pity that so many people are working on a language that will be only studied in compilation course. There something wrong with D development and I don't know exactly what. Before working on D 2.0 maybe you should work to make D 1.0 working on more targets with ide integration.
First I was very motivated by this new language but I am developper specialized in smartphones (wince, symbian, iphone) and I cannot even use it on these platforms.
If I was milionnair I would pay someone to work on GDC because this would be the first step for notoriety. Two years ago I generated a D cross-compiler targeting windows ce but now since gdc is not maitained I am not interested anymore in D.
I tried to talk about D language to some gcc hackers but they don't seem to be very interested.
I am waiting for new pragmatic projects, for instance I am watching ooc projet(http://ooc-lang.org/) that could be a good candidate for what I want to do.
So if you don't want D join other dead language at museum, please focus on simple things and make it availaible for all platforms.

PS : I don't want to start a war ;-) I am just disappointed that I still cannot use it on arm platforms and I am not the only one I think.
By the way what is the status of llvm D ?
And is there any remaining bug in D 1.0 ?

On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 10:36 AM, smartmobili<anonymous@nospam.fr> wrote:

> PS : I don't want to start a war ;-) I am just disappointed that I still cannot use it on arm platforms and I am not the only one I think.

I can and have.  Making an LDC cross-compiler for ARM is as simple as building LDC with the 'arm' LLVM package and using the -march=arm flag.  Now the ball's in your court to make a runtime that works on one of these [closed, proprietary, wildly-varying and non-posix-compliant] platforms.

> By the way what is the status of llvm D ?
> And is there any remaining bug in D 1.0 ?

No, not at all!  D 1.0 is _completely bug free_.
Of course it has bugs.  Are you kidding me?  Even Knuth's programs have bugs.

Jarrett Billingsley a écrit :
> On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 10:36 AM, smartmobili<anonymous@nospam.fr> wrote:
> 
>> PS : I don't want to start a war ;-) I am just disappointed that I still
>> cannot use it on arm platforms and I am not the only one I think.
> 
> I can and have.  Making an LDC cross-compiler for ARM is as simple as
> building LDC with the 'arm' LLVM package and using the -march=arm
> flag.  Now the ball's in your court to make a runtime that works on
> one of these [closed, proprietary, wildly-varying and
> non-posix-compliant] platforms.
> 
>> By the way what is the status of llvm D ?
>> And is there any remaining bug in D 1.0 ?
> 
> No, not at all!  D 1.0 is _completely bug free_.
> Of course it has bugs.  Are you kidding me?  Even Knuth's programs have bugs.

bug was not the right word sorry maybe inconsitency is better.
Last time there was some issues with circular import or something like that.

On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 11:40 AM, smartmobili<anonymous@nospam.fr> wrote:
>> Of course it has bugs.  Are you kidding me?  Even Knuth's programs have bugs.
>
> bug was not the right word sorry maybe inconsitency is better.
> Last time there was some issues with circular import or something like that.

Yeah, that's a bug.  And it's still there.  Just have a look at the open bugs in Bugzilla.

Robert Clipsham wrote:
> === Installing ===
> 
> Leading on from Jarrett's comments, installing a full toolchain is... well... not easy. Again, this is improving, with the likes of the nightly ubuntu packages of ldc and qtd, it would be good if we could come up with a way of allowing a full toolchain to be as easily installable on all systems.

I posted a relevant announcement about this on the D.announce group.

Walter Bright, el 27 de junio a las 16:06 me escribiste:
> Robert Clipsham wrote:
> >=== Installing ===
> >Leading on from Jarrett's comments, installing a full toolchain is... well... not easy. Again, this is improving, with the likes of the nightly ubuntu
> >packages of ldc and qtd, it would be good if we could come up with a way of allowing a full toolchain to be as easily installable on all systems.
> 
> I posted a relevant announcement about this on the D.announce group.

I think it would be great if LDC is listed in the D official website, GDC is listed for example and it's way too obsolete. I think that can give the impression that there is no working updated compiler other than DMD.

-- 
Leandro Lucarella (luca) | Blog colectivo: http://www.mazziblog.com.ar/blog/
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Pero nadie más la vió y hoy sigo pidiendo perdón

Leandro Lucarella wrote:
> I think it would be great if LDC is listed in the D official website, GDC
> is listed for example and it's way too obsolete. I think that can give the
> impression that there is no working updated compiler other than DMD.


Sure. What url do you want me to use? Better yet, send me the text & link.