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Thread overview
Ownership and Borrowing in D
Jul 15, 2019
Mike Parker
Jul 16, 2019
Mike Franklin
Jul 16, 2019
Walter Bright
Jul 16, 2019
Newbie2019
Jul 17, 2019
Olivier FAURE
Jul 17, 2019
Walter Bright
Jul 19, 2019
Timon Gehr
Jul 21, 2019
Olivier FAURE
Jul 20, 2019
Sebastiaan Koppe
Jul 20, 2019
Walter Bright
Jul 20, 2019
Sebastiaan Koppe
Jul 21, 2019
Walter Bright
Jul 23, 2019
Timon Gehr
Jul 23, 2019
Sebastiaan Koppe
Jul 23, 2019
Timon Gehr
Jul 23, 2019
Olivier FAURE
Jul 23, 2019
Sebastiaan Koppe
Jul 23, 2019
Olivier FAURE
Jul 21, 2019
Per Nordlöw
Jul 21, 2019
Max Haughton
Jul 21, 2019
12345swordy
Jul 16, 2019
rikki cattermole
Jul 16, 2019
Walter Bright
Jul 16, 2019
Walter Bright
Jul 17, 2019
Walter Bright
Jul 17, 2019
Olivier FAURE
July 15, 2019
In the Draft Review for Walter's DIP, Argument Ownership and Function Calls (which in the next half hour or so will be starting a community review as DIP 1021), some folks asked for some information about the bigger picture. In response, Walter has put together a post outlining his current thinking on how to add Ownership and Borrowing to D.

This is just an overview and he's currently working on a more comprehensive proposal, but it should provide some context for those who want it when reviewing DIP 1021.

The blog:
https://dlang.org/blog/2019/07/15/ownership-and-borrowing-in-d/

Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/cdifbu/ownership_and_borrowing_in_d/
July 16, 2019
On Monday, 15 July 2019 at 14:58:55 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:
> In the Draft Review for Walter's DIP, Argument Ownership and Function Calls (which in the next half hour or so will be starting a community review as DIP 1021), some folks asked for some information about the bigger picture. In response, Walter has put together a post outlining his current thinking on how to add Ownership and Borrowing to D.

Thank you, Walter.  This is very exciting.  I've said that if I could have my ideal language, it would be Dust, and now I just might get it :)

Mike
July 16, 2019
Wonderful quote from you Walter!

> The careful reader will notice something peculiar in what I wrote: “as if”. What do I mean by that weasel wording? Is there some skullduggery going on? Why yes, there is. Computer languages are full of “as if” dirty deeds under the hood, like the money you deposit in your bank account isn’t actually there (I apologize if this is a rude shock to anyone), and this isn’t any different. Read on!

I copied that over to Oceania's Discord server to talk about (very well received).
July 15, 2019
Now on the front page of Hacker News at number 9!

https://news.ycombinator.com/news
July 15, 2019
On 7/15/2019 8:52 PM, rikki cattermole wrote:
> Wonderful quote from you Walter!
> 
>> The careful reader will notice something peculiar in what I wrote: “as if”. What do I mean by that weasel wording? Is there some skullduggery going on? Why yes, there is. Computer languages are full of “as if” dirty deeds under the hood, like the money you deposit in your bank account isn’t actually there (I apologize if this is a rude shock to anyone), and this isn’t any different. Read on!
> 
> I copied that over to Oceania's Discord server to talk about (very well received).

Thanks for letting me know. I enjoyed writing it.

July 15, 2019
On 7/15/2019 7:07 PM, Mike Franklin wrote:
> Thank you, Walter.  This is very exciting.  I've said that if I could have my ideal language, it would be Dust, and now I just might get it :)

Now I just have to deliver the goods!
July 16, 2019
On Tuesday, 16 July 2019 at 06:12:42 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
> Now I just have to deliver the goods!

Very exciting about d have the @live and borrow owner feature.

How do you plan to handle move ?  dose it depends on DIP1014 ?
July 16, 2019
On 7/15/2019 7:58 AM, Mike Parker wrote:
> The blog:
> https://dlang.org/blog/2019/07/15/ownership-and-borrowing-in-d/
> 
> Reddit:
> https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/cdifbu/ownership_and_borrowing_in_d/

Hacker News:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20441519
July 17, 2019
On Monday, 15 July 2019 at 14:58:55 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:
> some folks asked for some information about the bigger picture.

As one of the folks that asked for that information, thank you Walter for posting this :)

The system described is a little rough around the edges, but it's really helpful to inform the discussion around DIP 1021!
July 17, 2019
On Tuesday, 16 July 2019 at 06:12:42 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
> Now I just have to deliver the goods!

Lately, I've been thinking about the possibility of an alternative ownership system for D, one that would be radically different from what you're considering, but still aim for the same features (memory safety, compile-time checking, zero-cost abstraction), based on a `unique` qualifier.

If I were to write a formal proposal for it, how interested would you be in comparing the two schemes (DIP 1021 and eventually Rust "one mutable ref" rule, vs unique qualifier)?

Like, I want to make my pitch, but I don't want to spend huge amount of effort on it if you're just going to go with DIP 1021 anyway.
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