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January 31, 2012
Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a Getting 
Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as effortless as 
possible by providing all the information and resources needed for one 
to dive right into D. Not everything needs to be covered by this page, 
but it should provide links as necessary.

Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can 
list more):

- Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
- Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
- Downloads
- List of IDEs / Editors that support D
- Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
- Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
- Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
- Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring

Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!
January 31, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
> Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a 
> Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as 
> effortless as possible by providing all the information and 
> resources needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything 
> needs to be covered by this page, but it should provide links 
> as necessary.

Hmmm, I would also think having a section of tutorials that steps 
you through the process, perhaps as a video on youtube? Course 
the tutorials I'm thinking is taking something and either 
converting C++ code, or making something original and then 
expanding it and the thought process on how to improve the code, 
adding generics and templates, writing a mixing function one step 
at a time. Adding a unittest to prove it works.

Perhaps I'm thinking more of a walk-through lecture, since I 
don't want so much a wall of text as someone actually talking to 
me.

It could do that for almost everything, explaining how a delegate 
would be useful and why it works, and a few good portions on text 
and string manipulation for unicode.

So far the best examples on coding and whatnot were from a 
stanford university lecture and an introduction to the [b]STL[/b] 
from microsoft.


Hmmm I also think perhaps adding a easy pdf download of the 
library reference you could print off; I find it increasingly 
annoying to switch back and forth on the html when I wouldn't 
mind having it in a paper form. But perhaps that's just me....
January 31, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
On 31 January 2012 05:31, Xinok <xinok@live.com> wrote:
> Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a Getting
> Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as effortless as
> possible by providing all the information and resources needed for one to
> dive right into D. Not everything needs to be covered by this page, but it
> should provide links as necessary.
>
> Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can list
> more):
>
> - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
> - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
> - Downloads
> - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
> - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
> - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
> - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
> - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring
>
> Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!

I think it would be great if we had a beginners guide in the spirit of
http://learnyouahaskell.com

-- 
Iain Buclaw

*(p < e ? p++ : p) = (c & 0x0f) + '0';
January 31, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
> Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a 
> Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as 
> effortless as possible by providing all the information and 
> resources needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything 
> needs to be covered by this page, but it should provide links 
> as necessary.
>
> Just to list some things that should be covered on this page 
> (you can list more):
>
> - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
> - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
> - Downloads
> - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
> - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
> - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
> - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
> - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for 
> configuring
>
> Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of 
> date!

Well, this is how Wiki4D[1] is set up. Actually that is basically 
all it is. I think you list is way to long for a single page. 
Improvements are welcome, it is maintained by anyone willing to 
look at it, including DigitalMars.

1. http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?FrontPage
January 31, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
On 1/31/2012 10:45 AM, Jesse Phillips wrote:
> Well, this is how Wiki4D[1] is set up. Actually that is basically all it
> is. I think you list is way to long for a single page. Improvements are
> welcome, it is maintained by anyone willing to look at it, including
> DigitalMars.
>
> 1. http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?FrontPage

The problem is that newcomers shouldn't have to hunt for this 
information. While that link could suffice, it's simply unprofessional 
to force them to jump between websites to find the information they 
need. There needs to be an obvious place, a single well-structured page 
on the official website with everything they need to know to get started.
January 31, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
As I mentioned I think this list is too much for one page, it is 
just overwhelming.

> - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.

This would be nice, but it too easy to be bias in describing the 
situation, especially since it exists only for D 1.x which is 
being phased out.

> - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)

There are links found when you select Tools & Downloads.

> - Downloads

In the Tools & Downloads link.

> - List of IDEs / Editors that support D

This list is overwhelming, subjective, and a link is provided to 
Wiki4D from Tools & Downloads.

> - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D

There is a link to the Tutorial chapter of "The D Programming 
Language" under Documentation.

> - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D

Under Community there is a Links link, that is not well 
maintained.

> - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)

Under Links.

> - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for 
> configuring

Community contains a link for Forms, or actually the Newsgroups 
and provides the web interface for those not setting up a client. 
Yes this needs updated and DFeed needs to move to 
d-programming-language.org.

> Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of 
> date!

No, update the pages that exist, and keep them up to date.
January 31, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
> Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a 
> Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as 
> effortless as possible by providing all the information and 
> resources needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything 
> needs to be covered by this page, but it should provide links 
> as necessary.
>
> Just to list some things that should be covered on this page 
> (you can list more):
>
> - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
> - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
> - Downloads
> - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
> - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
> - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
> - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
> - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for 
> configuring
>
> Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of 
> date!

That would be a dream, really!

In fact, you can find some information about this topics on the 
website in some places, but the main question is why not group 
them all in one place for the beginners.

I felt and still feel a bit lost with D. So, I enter everyday on 
this NG to understand things a bit. But I think the things should 
be more friendly.
February 01, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
On 1/31/2012 11:47 AM, Jesse Phillips wrote:
> As I mentioned I think this list is too much for one page, it is just
> overwhelming.

It doesn't have to be a wall of text. If done right, it would be a 
well-structured page split up into sections which is easy to navigate 
and find the information one would want.

Something I didn't make clear, I think it's okay to provide links to 
other pages (in moderation, let's not just have a page full of links), 
as long as those pages aren't out of date.

>> - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
>
> This would be nice, but it too easy to be bias in describing the
> situation, especially since it exists only for D 1.x which is being
> phased out.

I don't see how it would be biased. Phobos is the official standard 
library, Tango is a third-party standard library which is for D 1.x 
only. D 2.x is the latest version while D 1.x is being phased out and 
will be maintained until the end of 2012.

>> - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
>
> There are links found when you select Tools & Downloads.

It doesn't provide any explanation though. The information is scattered 
everywhere, you have to go hunting for it which only adds to the confusion.

>> - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
>
> This list is overwhelming, subjective, and a link is provided to Wiki4D
> from Tools & Downloads.

As I mentioned above, I think it's okay to provide a link rather than 
having a large list. Perhaps it would be best to list a few popular 
editors (DDT, VisualD) and provide that link for the rest.

>> - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
>
> There is a link to the Tutorial chapter of "The D Programming Language"
> under Documentation.

Once again, information is scattered and you have to go looking for it. 
There's also other learning materials for D which aren't linked to 
anywhere AFAIK.

>> - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
>
> Under Community there is a Links link, that is not well maintained.
>
>> - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
>
> Under Links.

The list is very out of date, and "links" at the bottom of the page is 
not an obvious place to look for this information.

>> - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring
>
> Community contains a link for Forms, or actually the Newsgroups and
> provides the web interface for those not setting up a client. Yes this
> needs updated and DFeed needs to move to d-programming-language.org.
>
>> Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!
>
> No, update the pages that exist, and keep them up to date.

Ideally, the website would be maintained and easier to navigate. 
However, it doesn't seem to be a high priority or else it would be done 
already. At least this way, it's a single page which could be put up in 
less than a day and is little effort to maintain. It's an obvious place 
to look as well ("Getting Started", who wouldn't look there first?).

This page would serve as a single entry point which would help newcomers:

- Download and install the compiler
- Download / Configure an IDE or Editor
- Write and Compile their first program
- Find learning materials
- Find resources such as libraries and debuggers
- Get them involved in the community
- Participate in the development of D

That sounds worth it to me.
February 01, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
Le 31/01/2012 20:01, Mattbeui a écrit :
> On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
>> Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a
>> Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as
>> effortless as possible by providing all the information and resources
>> needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything needs to be
>> covered by this page, but it should provide links as necessary.
>>
>> Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can
>> list more):
>>
>> - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
>> - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
>> - Downloads
>> - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
>> - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
>> - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
>> - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
>> - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring
>>
>> Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!
>
> That would be a dream, really!
>
> In fact, you can find some information about this topics on the website
> in some places, but the main question is why not group them all in one
> place for the beginners.
>
> I felt and still feel a bit lost with D. So, I enter everyday on this NG
> to understand things a bit. But I think the things should be more friendly.

Definitively. I think the first step should be to get rid of deprected 
stuffs (maybe reenable them with compiler switch).

The second thing is to make the toolchain more reliable.

The problem with this tutorial, in the current state of things, is that 
it would have to introduce deprecated stuffs, or that the newcomer can 
encounter compiler/phobos bugs even when using valid things. Think of 
toString on a const object, this a legitimate thing to do and avery 
newcomer will try it as soon as they know about const or about object 
(depending on which one is presented first).
February 01, 2012
Re: Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page
On 1 February 2012 17:08, deadalnix <deadalnix@gmail.com> wrote:
> Le 31/01/2012 20:01, Mattbeui a écrit :
>
>> On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
>>>
>>> Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a
>>> Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as
>>> effortless as possible by providing all the information and resources
>>> needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything needs to be
>>> covered by this page, but it should provide links as necessary.
>>>
>>> Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can
>>> list more):
>>>
>>> - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
>>> - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
>>> - Downloads
>>> - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
>>> - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
>>> - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
>>> - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
>>> - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring
>>>
>>> Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!
>>
>>
>> That would be a dream, really!
>>
>> In fact, you can find some information about this topics on the website
>> in some places, but the main question is why not group them all in one
>> place for the beginners.
>>
>> I felt and still feel a bit lost with D. So, I enter everyday on this NG
>> to understand things a bit. But I think the things should be more
>> friendly.
>
>
> Definitively. I think the first step should be to get rid of deprected
> stuffs (maybe reenable them with compiler switch).
>

I do believe phobos should be dropping a few functions this month if
the pragma(msg) warnings I see when building prove to be correct. :)


-- 
Iain Buclaw

*(p < e ? p++ : p) = (c & 0x0f) + '0';
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