On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 08:43:39 UTC, Sönke Ludwig wrote:
> And how do you verify that that's a better classification? If you look at the graphs of any of "D", "dlang", "D programming language", "D language", "D programming", none of them seems to correlate with events such as the date of first publication, version 1.000, version 2.000, the conferences etc.

You have to make a qualitative judgement. Terms such as "dlang" has only been in used in recent years and probably only by invested users. It is difficult to find terms for "D" that have enough volume to show up. "d programming language" is probably only used by non-users, it shows a clear spike in october 2004, july 2005, january 2007, july 2014, but a general falling trend. While "dlang" is more stable.

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 08:53:27 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
> enough volume to show up. "d programming language" is probably only used by non-users, it shows a clear spike in october 2004, july 2005, january 2007, july 2014, but a general falling trend. While "dlang" is more stable.

The cause of the biggest spike of interest,  january 2007:

http://developers.slashdot.org/story/07/01/01/2041256/the-d-programming-language-version-10

Am 03.02.2016 um 09:53 schrieb Ola Fosheim Grøstad:
> On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 08:43:39 UTC, Sönke Ludwig wrote:
>> And how do you verify that that's a better classification? If you look
>> at the graphs of any of "D", "dlang", "D programming language", "D
>> language", "D programming", none of them seems to correlate with
>> events such as the date of first publication, version 1.000, version
>> 2.000, the conferences etc.
>
> You have to make a qualitative judgement. Terms such as "dlang" has only
> been in used in recent years and probably only by invested users. It is
> difficult to find terms for "D" that have enough volume to show up. "d
> programming language" is probably only used by non-users, it shows a
> clear spike in october 2004, july 2005, january 2007, july 2014, but a
> general falling trend. While "dlang" is more stable.

I agree with this in general, but the uncertainty is still far to high to be able to make comparisons between languages. Rough trends maybe.

BTW, this one (using the "programming" category) looks like it could be somewhat neutral: https://www.google.com/trends/explore#cat=0-5-31&q=d%20language%2C%20rust%20language%2C%20go%20language%2C%20swift%20language&cmpt=q&tz=Etc%2FGMT-1

At least it shows the characteristic spikes for each language and the related searches look reasonable. But the popularity of D pre-2007 looks odd, and with such a bias it's impossible to read anything out of the more recent numbers (in terms of absolute value) without wishful thinking.

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 09:09:20 UTC, Sönke Ludwig wrote:
> At least it shows the characteristic spikes for each language and the related searches look reasonable. But the popularity of D pre-2007 looks odd, and with such a bias it's impossible to read anything out of the more recent numbers (in terms of absolute value) without wishful thinking.

Yes, I think counting significant libraries/framworks and github activity provide better absolute measurements for comparable languages (Go, Rust, D), but doesn't work for enterprise languages.

Still, the trends says something about the future of competing languages, so if one want to lay down a strategy it can be useful. And it also can tell us something about what events leads to increased/falling interest.

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 07:06:47 UTC, cym13 wrote:
[...]
> I don't quite know what the leading factor for that change was but it sure will be great for its image.

Oh, I am sure I caused it myself, I am new on D and all my searching for it and than Bang  ! :-)

So, don't try to understand Tiobe, just be happy D is a new entry for top 20, and work hard to improve DMD, GDC, LDC, DUB, vibe.d etc... to make this real cool programming experience open for more people. Like me, frustrated from ever faster computers becoming slower by scripting languages and Browsers doing the job, where a real alternative is around the corner: D.

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 10:41:40 UTC, Martin Tschierschke wrote:
> open for more people. Like me, frustrated from ever faster computers becoming slower by scripting languages and Browsers doing the job, where a real alternative is around the corner: D.

D has been around the corner for a D-ecade. The corner is constantly moving so that is obviously not a winning strategy.

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 07:06:47 UTC, cym13 wrote:
> It's all true, D rose up 6 positions: http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html
>
> I don't quite know what the leading factor for that change was but it sure will be great for its image.

Well, people who observe TIOBE index knew this is going to happen. Did we? :)

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 10:43:44 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
> On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 10:41:40 UTC, Martin Tschierschke wrote:
>> open for more people. Like me, frustrated from ever faster computers becoming slower by scripting languages and Browsers doing the job, where a real alternative is around the corner: D.
>
> D has been around the corner for a D-ecade. The corner is constantly moving so that is obviously not a winning strategy.
If something is around the corner, you must know!

So I got it via this:
http://www.heise.de/developer/meldung/Programmiersprache-D-Compiler-ist-jetzt-selbst-in-D-geschrieben-2869589.html

The most read IT News Ticker in Germany, pointing to D, saying that the D compiler now is written in D, and what made me interested, the reference to C++ and Ruby.
So I started to read Wikipedia and in the end I gave it a try.

What about making a special voting list/page, where every one registered to the forum, can
put in, why he/she is using D and vote for other arguments giving + or maybe - points.

And a special second list, where people can vote, which topic of D (language or environemt) need to be improved most?

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 12:06:30 UTC, Martin Tschierschke wrote:
> If something is around the corner, you must know!

There are many corners. Some, like the corner of compiled languages with automatic memory management and high level features have moved a lot in the past few years (Swift and Go). It is gone. There is no way for D to catch up with Swift and Go.

The other corner, taken by C, C++ and now also Rust, moves a lot slower and is in some areas incapable of moving. So I think the current focus on interfacing with C++ is the right focus, just keep focused on it. D needs to reach parity with common C++ features and then do it better across the board.

C++ is basically incapable of undoing past bad design decisions. D also have baggage, but D is fortunate enough to have commercial users who have clearly stated that they welcome breaking changes, so D can thankfully get rid of bad design choices.

C++ cannot break existing code, and Rust has gone down a trail of semantics that leads to complicated compiler design. That's to D's advantage, if D avoid going down similar complicated routes (unfortunately some DIPs suggests otherwise). There's lots of potential there if the D designers stay focused on that target and take the fast path (avoid convoluted semantics and compiler requirements).


> And a special second list, where people can vote, which topic of D (language or environemt) need to be improved most?

The historical challenge for D is a tendency to spread out. Voting is no good, it takes away focus. Then you are back to hunting down many corners, and D will remain one step behind.

On Wednesday, 3 February 2016 at 08:53:27 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
>
> You have to make a qualitative judgement. Terms such as "dlang" has only been in used in recent years and probably only by invested users. It is difficult to find terms for "D" that have enough volume to show up. "d programming language" is probably only used by non-users, it shows a clear spike in october 2004, july 2005, january 2007, july 2014, but a general falling trend. While "dlang" is more stable.

I never search dlang. I typically search d language