On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 09:48:21 UTC, forkit wrote:
> On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 09:41:46 UTC, claptrap wrote:
>>
>> Its not hard to stick to arguing facts. Just avoid things like calling people passive aggressive when they disagree with you.
>>
>
> Lets compromise on that a little.
>
> When people are being passive-aggressive, I call them as being passive-aggresive.
>
> And when their not, I won't.
>
> How does that sound?

That's not what you were doing. A large proportion of responses to your messages were reasonable. The proportion of your messages accusing people of being passive-aggressive/ignorant/gutless etc. is not.

Jordan

On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 09:48:21 UTC, forkit wrote:
> On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 09:41:46 UTC, claptrap wrote:
>>
>> Its not hard to stick to arguing facts. Just avoid things like calling people passive aggressive when they disagree with you.
>>
>
> Lets compromise on that a little.
>
> When people are being passive-aggressive, I call them as being passive-aggresive.
>
> And when their not, I won't.
>
> How does that sound?

Dont call people anything. If you want a respectful technical discusion avoid anything personal. Argue the facts of what they say not your emotional response to it.

Which is exactly how i responded to you in the "adding a new design constraint thread" and your response was to label me passive aggressive. Seriously go back and read it.

You dont even know what passive aggressive means. Me replying to other people saying things i knew would indirectly set you off was passive aggressive. Me replying to you directly and respectfully was not.

Savy?

On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 09:44:43 UTC, forkit wrote:
> On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 09:31:02 UTC, claptrap wrote:
>>
>> It has likely still driven people away from C++, i mean you're posting this in a forum of a language that was in large a reaction to the flaes in C++, where most of the users are ex-C++ programmers.
>
> True. But it's been 22 years now.

So what?


>>
>> IE. That C++ is still popular does not mean the negative view of it hasn't driven people away. I dont miss it and hope I never have to use it ever again.
>
> The question is, how is D going to keep programmers (not so much attract them), when these other languages are going full-speed ahead.

Is D losing programmers?

Seems like people go..

D is cool, except i dont like X, and if D had Y it would be huge, why arent things being fixed / added quicker? D needs more users, being more popular would solve all the problems.

On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 02:48:32 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
> My own C compiler did poorly until I partnered with John Haggins, a born marketer. Wow, what a difference he made!

Did he just help you market existing features in your C compiler, or did he point out what features you should add to win sales?

On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 02:48:32 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
> My own C compiler did poorly until I partnered with John Haggins, a born marketer. Wow, what a difference he made!

If you know such capable people, why don't you try to win them over to work on D?
Or did you, and they refused?

On 6/23/2022 10:30 PM, forkit wrote:
> Just wear something under it. It'll make it a little less uncomfortable.

What I mean by wearing a hairshirt is insistence on negging D. There are many ways to be honest about D's capabilities without describing them in negative terms.

For example:

Hairshirt - D's gc is terrible compared with Java's.

Honesty - Since Java is heavily dependent on the gc, it is worth it to insert write gates into the generated code to accurately track usage of gc allocated memory. Usage of D's gc is optional, and D's semantics are much less reliant on the gc. Hence, in the interest of maximum performance for most code, D does not insert write gates in the generated code.

On 25/06/2022 7:51 AM, Walter Bright wrote:
> Honesty - Since Java is heavily dependent on the gc, it is worth it to insert write gates into the generated code to accurately track usage of gc allocated memory. Usage of D's gc is optional, and D's semantics are much less reliant on the gc. Hence, in the interest of maximum performance for most code, D does not insert write gates in the generated code.

Unfortunately pretty much all the advanced GC's require write barriers.

We are almost maxed out on what we can do.

At some point its going to have to be implemented as opt-in if we want to allow people to experiment with them.

On 6/24/2022 4:59 AM, Dukc wrote:
> On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 02:48:32 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
>> My own C compiler did poorly until I partnered with John Haggins, a born marketer. Wow, what a difference he made!
> 
> Did he just help you market existing features in your C compiler, or did he point out what features you should add to win sales?

He knew how to work with magazines and journalists. He knew how to design advertisements. He knew how to bundle it with other desirable products. He'd organize press events. He knew how to frame the compiler's capabilities in a very positive (but still accurate) light. He knew how to put the product in an attractive box that was a pleasure to have on one's shelf.

BTW, the most effective marketing we do is write books and articles and make videos about D. Also attending conferences and make presentations about D. For example, I just returned from a 2 city tour in Poland making presentations about D, and I did another remote one for a Romanian coding conference.

On 6/24/2022 8:31 AM, Dom Disc wrote:
> On Friday, 24 June 2022 at 02:48:32 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
>> My own C compiler did poorly until I partnered with John Haggins, a born marketer. Wow, what a difference he made!
> 
> If you know such capable people, why don't you try to win them over to work on D?
> Or did you, and they refused?

John found me, and pitched his skills.