Civility (page 11)

June 29, 2022

Re: Civility

Posted by Chris
in reply to zjh

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Chris

Posted in reply to zjh

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On Wednesday, 29 June 2022 at 02:18:20 UTC, zjh wrote:

If you want to say what specific problems D has, you can discuss them. If you say that D has problems, D has problems. This is not good.

We all know that D has numerous problems that render it unusable (not minor quirks one can live with), and I won't reiterate them here, you just need to browse around in the forum a little bit and you'll see that the same issues keep coming up year after year, and even the leadership has realized that "something is rotten in the state of D" [1], Andrei only phrased it differently: "a variety of decisions that did not withstand the test of time". What a nice way of putting it. If you only mentioned autodecode a few years ago, you'd be in for a flamewar. Now it's the big revelation that it was a bad idea. If Andrei describes how C++ finally came out of the "dark ages" and suggests that this is the way forward for D, what else is this but the acknowledgement that D is now in the same position as C++ was years ago? So don't ask me about "specific problems", if the leadership itself compares D to C++ during its winter. It is also an acknowledgement that the critics were right about many of D's issues.

In my view, D is a weird mix of an 0.x language and C++. It has loads of baggage and dead weight, just like C++, but breaking changes and new features are introduced as if it was still below 1.0. So you get the worst of both: the clutter an old language accumulates in the attic over the years and the instability and unpredictability of a new language.

Why would I want to use it for any serious stuff?

[1] e.g.

On Tuesday, 28 June 2022 at 20:58:07 UTC, Dukc wrote: > > I understand if you want to do that, but I still think you could, and ought, to do that in a less hostile tone. That's a tough one now, how could I make "flawed beyond repair" sound nicer (I don't think it sounds "hostile", though, seriously. Inconvenient opinions are not automatically "hostile". Maybe it's a generational issue.). Let me try: D users frequently encounter difficulties that are hard and sometimes impossible to overcome and for which there seems to be no viable short, mid or long term solution. Here's a longer explanation: https://forum.dlang.org/post/qnynzfpztnprbvyhthhk@forum.dlang.org

On Wednesday, 29 June 2022 at 10:42:03 UTC, Chris wrote: > On Tuesday, 28 June 2022 at 20:58:07 UTC, Dukc wrote: > >> >> I understand if you want to do that, but I still think you could, and ought, to do that in a less hostile tone. > > That's a tough one now, how could I make "flawed beyond repair" sound nicer. Meant your post as a whole.

On Wednesday, 29 June 2022 at 10:42:03 UTC, Chris wrote: > Let me try: D users frequently encounter difficulties that are hard and sometimes impossible to overcome and for which there seems to be no viable short, mid or long term solution. No, I think that's just your personal experience. A lot of us are perfectly happy with D.

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