Attached is a small pdf noting three outstanding issues ~ each of which has various bug reports stretching back into the old NG. Given that the v1.0 release is getting closer, it seemed appropriate to try getting some priority and/or traction.

Such things might simply fall by the wayside otherwise.


begin 666 The Three Sins of D Name Resolution.pdf
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end

some idiot wrote:

> Attached is a small pdf noting three outstanding issues ~ each of which has
> various bug reports stretching back into the old NG. Given that the v1.0
> release is getting closer, it seemed appropriate to try getting some
> priority and/or traction.
> 
> Such things might simply fall by the wayside otherwise.
> 
> 

All viable points that undoubtedly needs attention. What's fascinating about this post is how you can almost identify the author simply by the message "he" sends. Interesting!

Don't follow Andrew; you imply there's some kind of hidden identity ...


"Andrew Edwards" <ridimz_at@yahoo.dot.com> wrote in message news:cdsei9$1kh$1@digitaldaemon.com...
> some idiot wrote:
>
> > Attached is a small pdf noting three outstanding issues ~ each of which
has
> > various bug reports stretching back into the old NG. Given that the v1.0 release is getting closer, it seemed appropriate to try getting some priority and/or traction.
> >
> > Such things might simply fall by the wayside otherwise.
> >
> >
>
> All viable points that undoubtedly needs attention. What's fascinating about this post is how you can almost identify the author simply by the message "he" sends. Interesting!

Whoops! I see what you mean. That's what I get for posting from the laptop
(under CA sunshine).

Glad to know I'm consistent though! Or maybe you thought it was someone else?

<g>


"Andrew Edwards" <ridimz_at@yahoo.dot.com> wrote in message news:cdsei9$1kh$1@digitaldaemon.com...
> some idiot wrote:
>
> > Attached is a small pdf noting three outstanding issues ~ each of which
has
> > various bug reports stretching back into the old NG. Given that the v1.0 release is getting closer, it seemed appropriate to try getting some priority and/or traction.
> >
> > Such things might simply fall by the wayside otherwise.
> >
> >
>
> All viable points that undoubtedly needs attention. What's fascinating about this post is how you can almost identify the author simply by the message "he" sends. Interesting!

Kris wrote:
> Whoops! I see what you mean. That's what I get for posting from the laptop
> (under CA sunshine).
> 
> Glad to know I'm consistent though! Or maybe you thought it was someone
> else?
> 
> <g>

I knew who it was immediately. Even if it was PDF instead of a Word document (good call!).

I think your points were good. Hopefully, they're quirks of the implementation that can be unquirked.

-- 
Justin (a/k/a jcc7)
http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/

There's always one more thing: forgot to mention that the required use of alias regarding the peek-a-boo game doesn't compile for certain signatures:

class Writer
{
        void put (bit x){}
        void put (int x){}
}

class MyWriter : Writer
{
        alias Writer.put put;

        void put (bit x){}
}

"function put conflicts with MyWriter.put"



"some idiot" <fu@bar.org> wrote in message news:cdsd5t$u5$1@digitaldaemon.com...
> Attached is a small pdf noting three outstanding issues ~ each of which
has
> various bug reports stretching back into the old NG. Given that the v1.0 release is getting closer, it seemed appropriate to try getting some priority and/or traction.
>
> Such things might simply fall by the wayside otherwise.
>
>
>

On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 18:16:30 -0700, some idiot wrote:

> Attached is a small pdf noting three outstanding issues ~ each of which has various bug reports stretching back into the old NG. Given that the v1.0 release is getting closer, it seemed appropriate to try getting some priority and/or traction.
> 
> Such things might simply fall by the wayside otherwise.

I must be using a different version of D, because the three issues you mention are not a problem in v0.95.

The first one, referring to extern C functions do not produce any error messages. In fact, it compiles and runs just fine.

The second, using interfaces, is also correctly working here. By correct, I mean that it fails in exactly the way you say it does, because that's what I was expecting it to do - fail.

My understanding of an interface is that it is JUST a list of cuntions that must be implemented in the class that you specified with the interface name.

Here is the code in your example:

<code>
 interface IFoo
 {
  void foo ();
 }

 interface IBar
 {
  void bar ();
 }

 class Foo : IFoo
 {
  void foo ()
  {
  }
 }

 class Bar : Foo, IFoo, IBar
 {
  void bar()
  {
  }
 }
</code>

The problem is with class Bar. Here you explictly say that it is derived from class Foo, and must implement interface IFoo and IBar. However, you have only got it implementing bar(). The foo() is implemented in Foo but not in Bar. You are obviously expecting implemented interfaces to be inherited. Now although the foo() function IS inherited by Bar, you have also said it must be *implemented* in Bar too, but you didn't implement it.

In the third example, your Writer class does NOT implement any of the functions. And the MyWriter class only implements one of the functions, the one with (int). So when you try to call the function using (ulong) as an argument, the linker can't find any! This is exactly what I'd expect so I don't think taht D is in error here. Maybe you need to provide real implementation in the Writer class or else declare them as abstract functions. At least that way, you get a compiler error rather than a linker error.

So maybe I don't really understand what the issues are.
-- 
Derek
Melbourne, Australia

On Sat, 24 Jul 2004 15:32:51 +1000, Derek wrote:

> On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 18:16:30 -0700, some idiot wrote:
> 
> I must be using a different version of D, because the three issues you mention are not a problem in v0.95.

you're wrong the problems manifest on 0.95.

> 
> The first one, referring to extern C functions do not produce any error messages. In fact, it compiles and runs just fine.

you're wrong.

> 
> The second, using interfaces, is also correctly working here.

you're wrong.

I have 1400 lines like:

ddi/GC.d(61): class GC 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/GC.d(61): class GC 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/GC.d(61): class GC 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/Screen.d(66): class Screen 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/Screen.d(66): class Screen 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/Screen.d(66): class Screen 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/Visual.d(59): class Visual 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/Visual.d(59): class Visual 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
ddi/Visual.d(59): class Visual 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not implemented
dui/AccelGroup.d(59): class AccelGroup 1interface function OGTK.gtk is not
implemented

none of those classes declares to implement the interface
or is missing the method (as far as I can tell, you see 1400 lines...)

just adding or removing "private import ddi.Pixbuf;"
to class ddi.Value body makes the compiler produce or not those 1400
errors.
(it's not a typo it one thousand and four hundred lines)

> My understanding of an interface is that it is JUST a list of cuntions that must be implemented in the class that you specified with the interface name.

you're wrong.


> The problem is with class Bar. Here you explictly say that it is derived from class Foo, and must implement interface IFoo and IBar.

the example is wrong.

> In the third example,

alias is dumb for OO but D supports other paradigmas.

examples? I posted enough already.

Ant

Firstly, I apologize for not providing working examples. In the interests of brevity the code was sliced and diced to occupy minimal space ~ inline for the rest:

"Derek" <derek@psyc.ward> wrote ...
> The first one, referring to extern C functions do not produce any error messages. In fact, it compiles and runs just fine.

That's because (in the interests of brevity) I didn't attempt to make any references to the methods. Believe me, it's a problem we ran into with Mango (as were all these issues, and many more besides). I think you'll find several others will vouch for this also. There's a good writeup in the buglist if you care to look (6/10/2004).

> My understanding of an interface is that it is JUST a list of cuntions
that
> must be implemented in the class that you specified with the interface name.

That's essentially correct, except for one thing: the class has only to satisfy the contract to be in compliance (otherwise it's a 'partial' implementation: like an abstract class). It does not matter how that contract is implemented! I'm tempted to repeat that. When you build something of significant complexity, the exposed interface (the contract) rarely matches the implementation in terms of inheritance, and nor should it! That's one of the true benefits of Interfaces. In D, you have to stub and dispatch all kinds of stuff to satisfy the compiler, or dispense with your nice clean inheritance-based design. It's very, very, messy. And rapidly becomes brittle as complexity increases.

I'm not asking you to believe me Derek. Just build yourself something fairly complex using interfaces in D, and you'll run into this very quickly. Here's (a temporary link to) an older document written during the "Interface Wars" so you can get some additional history: http://svn.dsource.org/svn/projects/mango/trunk/doc/D%20Interfaces%20-%20v0. 82.pdf . Points #4 & #5 are the salient ones here.

> In the third example, your Writer class does NOT implement any of the functions. And the MyWriter class only implements one of the functions,
the
> one with (int). So when you try to call the function using (ulong) as an argument, the linker can't find any! This is exactly what I'd expect so I don't think taht D is in error here. Maybe you need to provide real implementation in the Writer class or else declare them as abstract functions. At least that way, you get a compiler error rather than a
linker
> error.

There's no need to shout mate ... I can 'hear' ya loud and clear <g> Again, that was just in the interests of brevity ... you have to understand that aspect of alias was added in a vague attempt to appease yet another problem exposed via Mango (in what I considered to be, and clearly expressed to Walter as a thorough hack). I'm afraid the examples were perhaps not as useful as I thought they were, although this was documented as a bug on several occasions.

Why don't you try the one I posted a little earlier that doesn't even compile, and get back to me please?

(fyi ~ I don't spend hours writing documents like those for fun ... it's a
PITA)

Derek wrote:

> In the third example, your Writer class does NOT implement any of the
> functions. And the MyWriter class only implements one of the functions, the
> one with (int). So when you try to call the function using (ulong) as an
> argument, the linker can't find any! This is exactly what I'd expect so I
> don't think taht D is in error here. Maybe you need to provide real
> implementation in the Writer class or else declare them as abstract
> functions. At least that way, you get a compiler error rather than a linker
> error.
> 
> So maybe I don't really understand what the issues are.

I won't comment on the first two as I haven't tried to do such things. The third problem is very real. Kris' example might not have implementations, but that's just for brevity (I suspect) as it really don't work for implemented functions. The workaround hack is incredibly unintuitive (and quite stupid) making D somewhat less of an OO language. The fact that it is only documented on the declarations page, just adds to the silliness of it all. How is _ANYONE_ coming to the language going to guess this? I flagged this as bug (together with many others) because I didn't know of the alias hack and got a system shock when I found out that it was intended behaviour. It is really a 'break' feature in a potential 'make or break' review of D.

Lars Ivar Igesund