I think to get D adopted more, someone in the know and with the skills (Walter? Matt?) has to write the book.  At least the first draft for on-line distribution.  I've been through the pages at the site, but nothing makes a new language stick like (small) examples and problems being solved.  The original book for C comes to mind as a short, sweet introduction.  I know D has more features, but then the book could be 25% bigger.

It wouldn't need to explain object theory, any more than the original C book explained programming style.  But it would need to use objects in a few object-worthy situations.

That kind of thing.  My two cents.

Actually, Matthew and Walter are co-writing a book on D... errr... are planning on co-writing a book on D... I think they're waiting for something closer to 1.0 and/or procrastinating.

John

Charlie Patterson wrote:
> I think to get D adopted more, someone in the know and with the skills (Walter? Matt?) has
> to write the book.  At least the first draft for on-line distribution.  I've been through
> the pages at the site, but nothing makes a new language stick like (small) examples and
> problems being solved.  The original book for C comes to mind as a short, sweet
> introduction.  I know D has more features, but then the book could be 25% bigger.
> 
> It wouldn't need to explain object theory, any more than the original C book explained
> programming style.  But it would need to use objects in a few object-worthy situations.
> 
> That kind of thing.  My two cents.
> 
> 
> 

"John Demme" <me@teqdruid.com> wrote in message news:cv6m5l$1h96$2@digitaldaemon.com...
> Actually, Matthew and Walter are co-writing a book on D... errr... are planning on co-writing a book on D... I think they're waiting for something closer to 1.0 and/or procrastinating.

Actually, we are not waiting any longer. Monday's the day we start. (Assuming I can get the three libs I'm killing myself on out before then. <g>)

>I think to get D adopted more, someone in the know and with the skills (Walter? Matt?) has
> to write the book.  At least the first draft for on-line distribution.  I've been through the pages at the site, but nothing makes a new language stick like (small) examples and problems being solved.  The original book for C comes to mind as a short, sweet introduction.  I know D has more features, but then the book could be 25% bigger.

Walter and I _are_ (about to be) writing a book together on D, called D Programming Distilled, for Addison-Wesley.

We're just sorting through the contract with the publisher, and then we'll get cracking. The intention is for it to be out before the end of the year.

I/we also plan to write, in a couple of years, The D Programming Language, and have discussed that with AW. For now, though, what's needed is a small (~250 pages) introductory volume.

The Dr .....

"John Demme" <me@teqdruid.com> wrote in message news:cv6m5l$1h96$2@digitaldaemon.com...
> Actually, Matthew and Walter are co-writing a book on D... errr... are planning on co-writing a book on D... I think they're waiting for something closer to 1.0 and/or procrastinating.

Actually, we are not waiting any longer. Monday's the day we start. (Assuming I can get the three libs I'm killing myself on out before then. <g>)

From: "Matthew" <admin.hat@stlsoft.dot.org>


> >I think to get D adopted more, someone in the know and with the skills (Walter? Matt?)
has
> > to write the book.
> > ...

> Walter and I _are_ (about to be) writing a book together on D, called D Programming
Distilled, for Addison-Wesley.

> We're just sorting through the contract with the publisher, and then we'll get cracking.
The intention is for it to be
> out before the end of the year.

> I/we also plan to write, in a couple of years, The D Programming Language, and have
discussed that with AW. For now,
> though, what's needed is a small (~250 pages) introductory volume.

Excellent!  As motivation, I think you'll see the language triple its user base the day this book comes out.

I'm not sure I know what the "distilled" series is about, but I hope it is full of practical examples using language features, instead of a feature list expounded upon (like the site).  But also avoid the "this is how you should do it; oh an never do this" attitude of Stroustrup which makes a book become way too long.  People will glean how to do it from good examples.

Oh and also... (-:

I would avoid preaching about how C++ got it wrong or any such topic which will get big. People either don't understand and don't care, or will pick it up implicitly.  For example, I think by now most programmers that care realize that single inheritance with interfaces can handle 98% of the noble uses of classes.  And that getting that last 2% isn't worth killing your compiler writer, or worth learning 20 esoteric rules for lattice inheritance.

I'm not trying to micromanage. (-:  Just some ideas.

> I'm not trying to micromanage. (-:  Just some ideas.

I agree completely, glad you came out and said it :).  Also Matt / W , if
this is too personal just let me know ;) , what kind of contract do
technical books get ( for royalties etc ) ?  Since D has always been free I
hope Walter gets a hefty sum off the book ( Id say the same for Matt but
imperfect has set him up pretty well I imagine :) ).

Charlie


"Charlie Patterson" <charliep1@SPAMIDDYSPAMexcite.com> wrote in message news:cv7n9g$3090$1@digitaldaemon.com...
> Oh and also... (-:
>
> I would avoid preaching about how C++ got it wrong or any such topic which
will get big.
> People either don't understand and don't care, or will pick it up
implicitly.  For
> example, I think by now most programmers that care realize that single
inheritance with
> interfaces can handle 98% of the noble uses of classes.  And that getting
that last 2%
> isn't worth killing your compiler writer, or worth learning 20 esoteric
rules for lattice
> inheritance.
>
> I'm not trying to micromanage. (-:  Just some ideas.
>
>
>

"Charles" <no@email.com> wrote in message news:cv8sdn$1g8n$1@digitaldaemon.com...
>> I'm not trying to micromanage. (-:  Just some ideas.
>
> I agree completely, glad you came out and said it :).  Also Matt / W ,
> if
> this is too personal just let me know ;) , what kind of contract do
> technical books get ( for royalties etc ) ?

Somewhere between 10 and 20% of *NET* royalties.

>  Since D has always been
> free I
> hope Walter gets a hefty sum off the book ( Id say the same for Matt
> but
> imperfect has set him up pretty well I imagine :) ).

Alas, your assumptions are (in a nice way) laughable.

A nicely selling tech book is one that does >=20,000 copies. Given that the author(s) sees about $1-2 from each sale, there's no way on Bob's green earth that one can *ever* directly earn back the time spent in doing the writing. I reckon the _best_ I can hope for with Imperfect C++ is to earn back 4% of what I'd likely have earned during the same time spent; with my forthcoming books - DPD and XSTL - my hope is that this'll maybe rise to something ~15%, but that may be pig flying stuff.

The motivation has to be internal, and non-financial. One might say that one writes for the good of the community, or for the challenge, or for the notoriety, etc. etc. But whatever it is, it ain't cash!

But having said that, I do hope you all prove me wrong by recommending IC++, DPD and XSTL to *everyone* you meet. <CG>

The Dr .....


P.S. If any of you ever have the pleasure of meeting my wife - the social adept of the family - please do *not* mention those percentages above. We've, er, never discussed it in such bald terms ...


>
> Charlie
>
>
> "Charlie Patterson" <charliep1@SPAMIDDYSPAMexcite.com> wrote in
> message
> news:cv7n9g$3090$1@digitaldaemon.com...
>> Oh and also... (-:
>>
>> I would avoid preaching about how C++ got it wrong or any such topic which
> will get big.
>> People either don't understand and don't care, or will pick it up
> implicitly.  For
>> example, I think by now most programmers that care realize that single
> inheritance with
>> interfaces can handle 98% of the noble uses of classes.  And that getting
> that last 2%
>> isn't worth killing your compiler writer, or worth learning 20 esoteric
> rules for lattice
>> inheritance.
>>
>> I'm not trying to micromanage. (-:  Just some ideas.
>>
>>
>>
>
>

Charlie Patterson wrote:
> Excellent!  As motivation, I think you'll see the language triple its user base the day
> this book comes out.
> 
> I'm not sure I know what the "distilled" series is about, but I hope it is full of
> practical examples using language features, instead of a feature list expounded upon (like
> the site).  But also avoid the "this is how you should do it; oh an never do this"
> attitude of Stroustrup which makes a book become way too long.  People will glean how to
> do it from good examples.

Heh, the way C++ is today, Stroustrup _has_ to write it like that.  :-)

In the D book, the things that are "usual" (read: like C, Java, etc.)
could be gone through real quickly, and then the D-specific things
would be explained in depth.

Not only what and how, but why and when!
And plenty of examples!

Oh, and get the first edition out with a "just do it" mentality.
Within 12 months from 1.0, D will have gained a lot more stuff,
and then you can sell 2nd edition again to all, plus the many
new readers!   :-)