https://nim-lang.org/blog/2019/09/23/version-100-released.html

Well, finally Nim team released 1.0. Now future releases shouldn't break people's code and this fact should increase language adoption. Still few things seems to be unfinished (like their NewRuntime thing), but I'd like to congratulate Nim's team with this big release. What do you think about it?

On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 10:01:40 UTC, Rel wrote:
> https://nim-lang.org/blog/2019/09/23/version-100-released.html
>
> Well, finally Nim team released 1.0. Now future releases shouldn't break people's code and this fact should increase language adoption. Still few things seems to be unfinished (like their NewRuntime thing), but I'd like to congratulate Nim's team with this big release. What do you think about it?

I've been looking at Nim every now and then, but I don't really like it. It's trying to cover too many bases. Don't like camelCase? Don't worry, snake_case and PascalCase works too. Don't like GC? Don't worry, you can use refcounting and manual memory management too.

Considering how APIs and libraries have to adapt to such multiple cases, I imagine the standard library is quite a mess.

On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 10:01:40 UTC, Rel wrote:
> https://nim-lang.org/blog/2019/09/23/version-100-released.html
>
> Well, finally Nim team released 1.0. Now future releases shouldn't break people's code and this fact should increase language adoption. Still few things seems to be unfinished (like their NewRuntime thing), but I'd like to congratulate Nim's team with this big release. What do you think about it?

The link above reads almost like a summary of "Don't do what D did!". Congratulations! I've been looking at Nim on and off (like most people, I suppose). One thing that really turns me off is that indentation is an integral part of the syntax [1]. Nim designers seem to forget that Python introduced forced indentation, because Python was meant to be used by non-programmers (chemists, biologists etc.), and thus this feature was there to "help" non-programmers to keep their code clean and tidy (cf. Perl!). However, Nim is targeting (experienced) programmers who really don't need a patronizing feature like that. This is a real bummer, in my opinion, like selling a bottle of whiskey with a child safety lock to a publican.


[1] https://nim-lang.org/docs/manual.html#lexical-analysis-indentation

On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 10:01:40 UTC, Rel wrote:
> https://nim-lang.org/blog/2019/09/23/version-100-released.html
>
> Well, finally Nim team released 1.0. Now future releases shouldn't break people's code and this fact should increase language adoption. Still few things seems to be unfinished (like their NewRuntime thing), but I'd like to congratulate Nim's team with this big release. What do you think about it?

I'm happy that they have come to the 1.0 release and I wish them the best. I have personally tinkered with Nim in order to see if it fits my projects. The language is ok but I find the standard libraries a bit inconsistent. Syntax wise it quite nice and you can achieve a lot with fewer lines. The reason I found D better for my purposes was that it was easier to port C like algorithms to D and also D has better libraries.

In my opinion Nim is one of the closest competitors of D because they are both runner up languages and they try to focus on productivity. Right now Rust seems to be influencing D a lot but I think if you want to look other languages, you should definitely also look at Nim.

On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 11:02:57 UTC, IGotD- wrote:
> On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 10:01:40 UTC, Rel wrote:
>> https://nim-lang.org/blog/2019/09/23/version-100-released.html
>>
> The reason I found D better for my purposes was that it was easier to port C like algorithms to D and also D has better libraries.
>
> In my opinion Nim is one of the closest competitors of D because they are both runner up languages and they try to focus on productivity. Right now Rust seems to be influencing D a lot but I think if you want to look other languages, you should definitely also look at Nim.

and at Zig https://ziglang.org/documentation/master/

On Wed, 2019-09-25 at 10:59 +0000, Chris via Digitalmars-d wrote: […]
> clean and tidy (cf. Perl!). However, Nim is targeting (experienced) programmers who really don't need a patronizing feature like that. This is a real bummer, in my opinion, like
[…]

Using whitespace instead of curly braces is not patronising, it is a language choice.

-- 
Russel.
===========================================
Dr Russel Winder      t: +44 20 7585 2200
41 Buckmaster Road    m: +44 7770 465 077
London SW11 1EN, UK   w: www.russel.org.uk

On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 12:50:42 UTC, Russel Winder wrote:
> On Wed, 2019-09-25 at 10:59 +0000, Chris via Digitalmars-d wrote: […]
>> clean and tidy (cf. Perl!). However, Nim is targeting (experienced) programmers who really don't need a patronizing feature like that. This is a real bummer, in my opinion, like
> […]
>
> Using whitespace instead of curly braces is not patronising, it is a language choice.

I will not engage in a discussion about Python-style whitespace tyranny again. In fact, it can render code actually _less_ readable and trigger compiler errors for no reason other than "missing indentation on line 149", copying and pasting can be a real nightmare. Fixing indentation can be time consuming - and what for? Forcing users to write "clean code". It might be a language choice - but then it's a bad one, and the fact remains that Python introduced it to nudge non-programmers into structuring their code. In other words, it was meant to be patronizing from the start. Indentation style should be decided on by the teams using the language and not be part of the language. Why is this so hard to understand?

On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 12:43:01 UTC, a11e99z wrote:
> On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 11:02:57 UTC, IGotD- wrote:
>> On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 10:01:40 UTC, Rel wrote:
>>> https://nim-lang.org/blog/2019/09/23/version-100-released.html
>>>
>> The reason I found D better for my purposes was that it was easier to port C like algorithms to D and also D has better libraries.
>>
>> In my opinion Nim is one of the closest competitors of D because they are both runner up languages and they try to focus on productivity. Right now Rust seems to be influencing D a lot but I think if you want to look other languages, you should definitely also look at Nim.
>
> and at Zig https://ziglang.org/documentation/master/

The funny thing about Zig is that right now it is a better C compiler, than a Zig compiler (in my personal opinion). Also I don't really like the idea of passing allocators around.

On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 13:04:25 UTC, Rel wrote:
> On Wednesday, 25 September 2019 at 12:43:01 UTC, a11e99z wrote:
>
>> and at Zig https://ziglang.org/documentation/master/
>
> The funny thing about Zig is that right now it is a better C compiler, than a Zig compiler (in my personal opinion). Also I don't really like the idea of passing allocators around.

when no coroutines that can be executed by any thread u can put default allocator at TLS else at coroutine context (and fix API)

On Wed, 2019-09-25 at 13:04 +0000, Chris via Digitalmars-d wrote: […]
> I will not engage in a discussion about Python-style whitespace tyranny again. In fact, it can render code actually _less_ readable and trigger compiler errors for no reason other than "missing indentation on line 149", copying and pasting can be a real nightmare. Fixing indentation can be time consuming - and what for? Forcing users to write "clean code". It might be a language choice - but then it's a bad one, and the fact remains that Python introduced it to nudge non-programmers into structuring their code. In other words, it was meant to be patronizing from the start. Indentation style should be decided on by the teams using the language and not be part of the language. Why is this so hard to understand?

Because it is your unsubstantiated opinion cast as some form of fact that is not a truth.

You have a right to your opinion, and clearly you hate the Python way of indentation (which must therefore include any programming language with an "offside rule" such as Haskell). You do not have a right to try and state that your opinion is fact that others must also believe.


-- 
Russel.
===========================================
Dr Russel Winder      t: +44 20 7585 2200
41 Buckmaster Road    m: +44 7770 465 077
London SW11 1EN, UK   w: www.russel.org.uk