On 27 September 2015 at 16:52, Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d@puremagic.com> wrote:
> On Sunday, 27 September 2015 at 06:34:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
>>
>> On 9/26/2015 10:20 AM, Brad Anderson wrote:
>>>
>>> Just a little aside tip, Windows search these days is actually really
>>> excellent
>>> for settings like this (and programs). Windows Key + "env" + Enter is
>>> enough to
>>> get you to the dialog.
>>
>>
>> Sorry, but the env dialog box is a sad joke, at least on Windows 7.
>>
>> 1. You cannot select any of the text in the dialog.
>> 2. You cannot increase the size of the dialog.
>> 3. Longer values end in "...".
>> 4. You cannot edit so-called "System" environment variables.
>> 5. You can scroll the list up or down, but not sideways!
>>
>> That all conspires to ensure that you CANNOT SEE what the longer values even are! It's pathetic.
>>
>> Back to the command line for me.
>
>
> I think that the only aspect of it which has changed since Windows 95 is the window style. Whenever I have to edit PATH, I copy it out of their horrible edit box, edit it in something like vim, and then copy it back. Honestly, MS should be embarrassed by the state of the env dialog box.
>
> - Jonathan M Davis

They simply don't recognise its existence. It's a piece of antiquated detritus, only used by strange people who wear woolen shirts pretending to be *nix users while using windows ;)

On 2015-09-26 21:30, extrawurst wrote:

> I tried visual studio code and it sucks - it is nothing but a text
> editor, a notepad with syntax highlighting like sublime only much worse ;)

I guess that depends on for which languages. For C# it supports accurate intellisense, refactoring, debugging and other features. I have not tried that myself so it could of course be a big fat lie.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg

On 27 September 2015 at 19:26, Jacob Carlborg via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d@puremagic.com> wrote:
> On 2015-09-26 21:30, extrawurst wrote:
>
>> I tried visual studio code and it sucks - it is nothing but a text editor, a notepad with syntax highlighting like sublime only much worse ;)
>
>
> I guess that depends on for which languages. For C# it supports accurate intellisense, refactoring, debugging and other features. I have not tried that myself so it could of course be a big fat lie.

Comprehensive plugin support is on the short-list apparently, and that
specifically includes support for plugging in language services, build
systems and debuggers.
I think it'll be a good editor in another year or 2. It's just nice
that a piece of linux software has corporate backing!

On 9/27/2015 12:54 AM, Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote:
> They simply don't recognise its existence. It's a piece of antiquated
> detritus, only used by strange people who wear woolen shirts
> pretending to be *nix users while using windows ;)

?? Visual Studio sets all these environment variables, in addition to the usual blizzard set by Microsoft Windows and other Microsoft programs:

C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\VC>set
Framework35Version=v3.5
FrameworkDir=C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64
FrameworkDIR64=C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64
FrameworkVersion=v4.0.30319
FrameworkVersion64=v4.0.30319
FSHARPINSTALLDIR=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft F#\v4.0\
INCLUDE=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\VC\INCLUDE;C:\Program Files (x86)\Micros
oft Visual Studio 10.0\VC\ATLMFC\INCLUDE;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft SDKs\Windows\v7.0A\include
;
LIB=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\VC\LIB\amd64;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsof
t Visual Studio 10.0\VC\ATLMFC\LIB\amd64;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft SDKs\Windows\v7.0A\lib\x64
;
LIBPATH=C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64\v4.0.30319;C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64\v3.5;C:
\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\VC\LIB\amd64;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visu
al Studio 10.0\VC\ATLMFC\LIB\amd64;
Path=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\VC\BIN\amd64;C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Frame
work64\v4.0.30319;C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64\v3.5;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual
Studio 10.0\VC\VCPackages;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\Common7\IDE;C:\Program
 Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\Common7\Tools;C:\Program Files (x86)\HTML Help Workshop;C:
\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft SDKs\Windows\v7.0A\bin\NETFX 4.0 Tools\x64;C:\Program Files (x86)\Mic
rosoft SDKs\Windows\v7.0A\bin\x64;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft SDKs\Windows\v7.0A\bin;C:\Program
 Files\Common Files\Microsoft Shared\Windows Live;C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Microsoft Shar
ed\Windows Live;C:\W
indows\System32\WindowsPowerShell\v1.0\;C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft SQL Server\100\Tools\Binn\;
C:\Program Files\Microsoft SQL Server\100\Tools\Binn\;C:\Program Files\Microsoft SQL Server\100\DTS\
Binn\;C:\Program Files (x86)\NVIDIA Corporation\PhysX\Common;C:\Program Files (x86)\Windows Live\Sha
red;C:\Program Files (x86)\Skype\Phone\
PATHEXT=.COM;.EXE;.BAT;.CMD;.VBS;.VBE;.JS;.JSE;.WSF;.WSH;.MSC
Platform=X64
VCINSTALLDIR=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\VC\
VSINSTALLDIR=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 10.0\
WindowsSdkDir=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft SDKs\Windows\v7.0A\

On 28 September 2015 at 09:51, Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d@puremagic.com> wrote:
> On 9/27/2015 12:54 AM, Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote:
>>
>> They simply don't recognise its existence. It's a piece of antiquated detritus, only used by strange people who wear woolen shirts pretending to be *nix users while using windows ;)
>
>
> ?? Visual Studio sets all these environment variables, in addition to the usual blizzard set by Microsoft Windows and other Microsoft programs:
>
> [...]

Huh? We're talking about the environment dialog box right... or so I though?

Maybe you're objecting with the suggestion that normal users really do
actively use environment variables? If so, your example refers to
auto-configured stuff that's completely invisible to average users, as
it should be in windows.
I've never used the VS command prompt in almost 20 years. Not once.
It's only linux ports that require you to mess with the environment in
windows. MS would never require that of a user.

On Monday, 28 September 2015 at 11:23:25 UTC, Manu wrote:
> On 28 September 2015 at 09:51, Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d@puremagic.com> wrote:
>> On 9/27/2015 12:54 AM, Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote:
>>>
>>> They simply don't recognise its existence. It's a piece of antiquated detritus, only used by strange people who wear woolen shirts pretending to be *nix users while using windows ;)
>>
>>
>> ?? Visual Studio sets all these environment variables, in addition to the usual blizzard set by Microsoft Windows and other Microsoft programs:
>>
>> [...]
>
> Huh? We're talking about the environment dialog box right... or so I though?
>
> Maybe you're objecting with the suggestion that normal users really do
> actively use environment variables? If so, your example refers to
> auto-configured stuff that's completely invisible to average users, as
> it should be in windows.
> I've never used the VS command prompt in almost 20 years. Not once.
> It's only linux ports that require you to mess with the environment in
> windows. MS would never require that of a user.

The alternative view is that MS messed it up so bad that it became nearly impossible to use manually, so they gave up and just wrote complicated automation to deal with it, making 3rd party development harder than it should be. Of course, it doesn't really matter why; it is what it is.

That said, I hate environment variables anywhere.

On Sunday, 27 September 2015 at 06:34:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
> On 9/26/2015 10:20 AM, Brad Anderson wrote:
>> Just a little aside tip, Windows search these days is actually really excellent
>> for settings like this (and programs). Windows Key + "env" + Enter is enough to
>> get you to the dialog.
>
> Sorry, but the env dialog box is a sad joke, at least on Windows 7.
>
> 1. You cannot select any of the text in the dialog.
> 2. You cannot increase the size of the dialog.
> 3. Longer values end in "...".
> 4. You cannot edit so-called "System" environment variables.
> 5. You can scroll the list up or down, but not sideways!
>
> That all conspires to ensure that you CANNOT SEE what the longer values even are! It's pathetic.
>
> Back to the command line for me.

http://www.rapidee.com/

On Sunday, 27 September 2015 at 06:34:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
> That all conspires to ensure that you CANNOT SEE what the longer values even are! It's pathetic.
>
Well they finally fixed that, at least.  A week ago.
http://www.ghacks.net/2015/09/22/microsoft-improves-environment-variables-editor-in-latest-windows-10-build/

...on the Windows version many people swear they'll never install.

-Wyatt

On Monday, 28 September 2015 at 15:08:55 UTC, Wyatt wrote:
> On Sunday, 27 September 2015 at 06:34:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
>> That all conspires to ensure that you CANNOT SEE what the longer values even are! It's pathetic.
>>
> Well they finally fixed that, at least.  A week ago.
> http://www.ghacks.net/2015/09/22/microsoft-improves-environment-variables-editor-in-latest-windows-10-build/
>
> ...on the Windows version many people swear they'll never install.

Well, I certainly won't be installing any version of Windows newer than 7 for years to come (if ever), but this is great news and _way_ long past due.

- Jonathan M Davis

On 9/28/2015 4:47 AM, John Colvin wrote:
> The alternative view is that MS messed it up so bad that it became nearly
> impossible to use manually, so they gave up and just wrote complicated
> automation to deal with it, making 3rd party development harder than it should
> be. Of course, it doesn't really matter why; it is what it is.

If Microsoft wants to have execrable tools for editting environment variables because environment variables are so yesterday, they should stop using them so extensively.