Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?

On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
> Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?

The language is fairly stable, but still far from complete. There's still several unimplemented and undesigned big features that could significantly affects what the best practices are (scope parameters and lack of copy constructors comes to mind).

Also, I think it's still a bit too early to put out a book on best practices in D. Not many people have lots of experience writing production D code.

On 6/14/2013 8:56 AM, Peter Alexander wrote:
> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
>> Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?
>
> The language is fairly stable, but still far from complete. There's still
> several unimplemented and undesigned big features that could significantly
> affects what the best practices are (scope parameters and lack of copy
> constructors comes to mind).
>
> Also, I think it's still a bit too early to put out a book on best practices in
> D. Not many people have lots of experience writing production D code.

It's true that "best practices" in D are still evolving. That's not a bad thing - best practices in C++ have changed a lot over the years.

On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
> Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?

Who would write it?

It seems to me that D is still new and not widespread, which means that everybody has their own styles and interpretation of how to use the language.

I could see someone writing a "Programming with Phobos" book(let) though, for example. But a full blown best practice for the entire language itself seems excessive to me. In particular, while *stable*, it *is* still "evolving", which means that while the old code still works, the patterns are still shifting.

On 6/14/2013 11:29 AM, monarch_dodra wrote:
> Who would write it?

Anyone who wants to!

> It seems to me that D is still new and not widespread, which means that
> everybody has their own styles and interpretation of how to use the language.
>
> I could see someone writing a "Programming with Phobos" book(let) though, for
> example. But a full blown best practice for the entire language itself seems
> excessive to me. In particular, while *stable*, it *is* still "evolving", which
> means that while the old code still works, the patterns are still shifting.

Although you are right, the best practices are still evolving, I don't think that automatically precludes writing a book on the current state of thought on the matter.

On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 18:29:10 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote:
> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
>> Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?
>
> Who would write it?

Did you read what you quoted? :-)

On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 19:38:10 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote:
> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 18:29:10 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote:
>> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
>>> Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?
>>
>> Who would write it?
>
> Did you read what you quoted? :-)

That was just a suggestion of course ;) And I am asking this after watching David Simcha's talk. There are language idioms clarifying already even if just while writing Phobos. And there can always be new editions with newly discovered idioms / patterns and good practices. But I do see your point on proper battlefield testing first.

On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 19:38:10 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote:
> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 18:29:10 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote:
>> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
>>> Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?
>>
>> Who would write it?
>
> Did you read what you quoted? :-)

I guess it does look silly like that :)

But the point I wanted to make came in the next sentence, is that I think that currently, no single person could write said book, because everyone has their own interpretation of best practices, or different types of use. Not even Andrei. We all have our own interpretation right now of how to use D. If the book was released by a single author, it would just be that person's interpretation of "Effective".

I would love to be proven wrong of course.

Another interesting project, given D's state, could be a collaborative "D idioms and patterns", for example?

On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 11:22:14PM +0200, monarch_dodra wrote:
> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 19:38:10 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote:
> >On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 18:29:10 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote:
> >>On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
> >>>Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?
> >>
> >>Who would write it?
> >
> >Did you read what you quoted? :-)
> 
> I guess it does look silly like that :)
> 
> But the point I wanted to make came in the next sentence, is that I think that currently, no single person could write said book, because everyone has their own interpretation of best practices, or different types of use. Not even Andrei. We all have our own interpretation right now of how to use D. If the book was released by a single author, it would just be that person's interpretation of "Effective".
> 
> I would love to be proven wrong of course.

What about collecting the most common D practices among us and seeing if some common trends show up?


> Another interesting project, given D's state, could be a collaborative "D idioms and patterns", for example?

Isn't there already a section on the wiki dedicated to that? It would help if more people would contribute their experiences.


T

-- 
When solving a problem, take care that you do not become part of the problem.

On 6/14/2013 11:29 AM, monarch_dodra wrote:
> In particular, while *stable*, it *is* still "evolving", which
> means that while the old code still works, the patterns are still shifting.

One example of that is Andrei and I have been discussing the idea of moving import declarations from their traditional place at the top of the file to being in the most nested scope in which they are referenced.