On Friday, June 14, 2013 20:29:09 monarch_dodra wrote:
> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
> > Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei authoring maybe?
> 
> Who would write it?

I'm a bit reticent to bring it up given that I won't be done anytime soon, but I actually started writing such a book following DConf. After Andrew brought up the possibility of Effective D in his talk and all of the talk that occurred at DConf about doing more with tutorials and publishing best practices, I decided that I'd give it shot.

And while I'm sure that there's plenty more best practices that we'll figure out over time, and some of what we do know has been shifting as we learn, I think that we do know enough at this point about best practices in D to fill such a book.

Interestingly enough, based on Andrei's suggestions, I'm writing it using ddoc so that it can easily be converted into latex, html, and e-book formats rather than being tied to any particular format (I was going to use latex, but Andrei thought that a macro language would be better as latex is very tied to physical print and fixed layouts). It'll probably be the first book ever to be written entirely in ddoc.

- Jonathan M Davis

On Saturday, 15 June 2013 at 02:17:59 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
> On Friday, June 14, 2013 20:29:09 monarch_dodra wrote:
>> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
>> > Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei
>> > authoring maybe?
>> 
>> Who would write it?
>
> I'm a bit reticent to bring it up given that I won't be done anytime soon, but
> I actually started writing such a book following DConf. After Andrew brought
> up the possibility of Effective D in his talk and all of the talk that occurred
> at DConf about doing more with tutorials and publishing best practices, I
> decided that I'd give it shot.
>
> And while I'm sure that there's plenty more best practices that we'll figure
> out over time, and some of what we do know has been shifting as we learn, I
> think that we do know enough at this point about best practices in D to fill
> such a book.
>
> Interestingly enough, based on Andrei's suggestions, I'm writing it using ddoc
> so that it can easily be converted into latex, html, and e-book formats rather
> than being tied to any particular format (I was going to use latex, but Andrei
> thought that a macro language would be better as latex is very tied to physical
> print and fixed layouts). It'll probably be the first book ever to be written
> entirely in ddoc.
>
> - Jonathan M Davis

Good jobs, I'm very much looking forward to reading it!

On 6/14/2013 7:17 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
> I'm a bit reticent to bring it up given that I won't be done anytime soon, but
> I actually started writing such a book following DConf. After Andrew brought
> up the possibility of Effective D in his talk and all of the talk that occurred
> at DConf about doing more with tutorials and publishing best practices, I
> decided that I'd give it shot.

Awesome!

> And while I'm sure that there's plenty more best practices that we'll figure
> out over time, and some of what we do know has been shifting as we learn, I
> think that we do know enough at this point about best practices in D to fill
> such a book.

Keep us posted.


> Interestingly enough, based on Andrei's suggestions, I'm writing it using ddoc
> so that it can easily be converted into latex, html, and e-book formats rather
> than being tied to any particular format (I was going to use latex, but Andrei
> thought that a macro language would be better as latex is very tied to physical
> print and fixed layouts). It'll probably be the first book ever to be written
> entirely in ddoc.

This is just being a win all around!

On Friday, June 14, 2013 19:57:52 Walter Bright wrote:
> > Interestingly enough, based on Andrei's suggestions, I'm writing it using ddoc so that it can easily be converted into latex, html, and e-book formats rather than being tied to any particular format (I was going to use latex, but Andrei thought that a macro language would be better as latex is very tied to physical print and fixed layouts). It'll probably be the first book ever to be written entirely in ddoc.
> 
> This is just being a win all around!

My one major complaint about using ddoc is the need for the $(P ) macro everywhere, whereas LaTeX inserts paragraphs based on empty lines. I should probably create an enhancement request for that (and maybe even try and implement it), but I have enough to do right now that I decided that I'd just put up with it for now. But aside from the need for $(P ) macros, it's actually quite pleasant to work with.

I do have to process the ddoc before giving it to the compiler in order to generate the table of contents and index macros (since you can't generate those with just macros), but since I'm using a D script to do the build, that was actually pretty easy.

So, I'm writing a book on D which is written in D's documentation macro language and using D to actually drive the build. It's all very D. :)

- Jonathan M Davis

On 6/14/2013 8:15 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
> My one major complaint about using ddoc is the need for the $(P ) macro
> everywhere, whereas LaTeX inserts paragraphs based on empty lines. I should
> probably create an enhancement request for that (and maybe even try and
> implement it), but I have enough to do right now that I decided that I'd just
> put up with it for now. But aside from the need for $(P ) macros, it's
> actually quite pleasant to work with.
>
> I do have to process the ddoc before giving it to the compiler in order to
> generate the table of contents and index macros (since you can't generate
> those with just macros), but since I'm using a D script to do the build,
> that was actually pretty easy.
>
> So, I'm writing a book on D which is written in D's documentation macro
> language and using D to actually drive the build. It's all very D. :)

I'd write it first without bothering with any formatting commands. Add them in at the end. (This is how I do all my articles.)

On Saturday, 15 June 2013 at 02:17:59 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
> On Friday, June 14, 2013 20:29:09 monarch_dodra wrote:
>> On Friday, 14 June 2013 at 15:38:02 UTC, Szymon Gatner wrote:
>> > Any plans on that now that language is stable enough? Andrei
>> > authoring maybe?
>> 
>> Who would write it?
>
> I'm a bit reticent to bring it up given that I won't be done anytime soon, but
> I actually started writing such a book following DConf. After Andrew brought
> up the possibility of Effective D in his talk and all of the talk that occurred
> at DConf about doing more with tutorials and publishing best practices, I
> decided that I'd give it shot.
>
> And while I'm sure that there's plenty more best practices that we'll figure
> out over time, and some of what we do know has been shifting as we learn, I
> think that we do know enough at this point about best practices in D to fill
> such a book.
>
> Interestingly enough, based on Andrei's suggestions, I'm writing it using ddoc
> so that it can easily be converted into latex, html, and e-book formats rather
> than being tied to any particular format (I was going to use latex, but Andrei
> thought that a macro language would be better as latex is very tied to physical
> print and fixed layouts). It'll probably be the first book ever to be written
> entirely in ddoc.
>
> - Jonathan M Davis

Would love to proof read it.

Btw: Not sure if "effective" series isn't somehow propertiary and linked to Herb Sutter. I know he is not only responsible for c++ but also for c# version

On Saturday, June 15, 2013 05:43:11 Szymon Gatner wrote:
> Btw: Not sure if "effective" series isn't somehow propertiary and linked to Herb Sutter. I know he is not only responsible for c++ but also for c# version

Scott Meyers wrote the C++ one, Bill Wagner wrote the C# one, and Joshua Bloch wrote the Javae one. I'm not aware of Herb Sutter having anything to do with any of them. And Effective Java was published via a different publisher from the other two, so my guess is that there would be no problem with the name Effective D. But I'm not married to the name "Effective D." It's simply the name that's been suggested and which would have recognition thanks to books with similar names in other languages. The important thing is the content of the book. If it ends up with a different name, then it ends up with a different name.

- Jonathan M Davis

On 6/14/2013 8:43 PM, Szymon Gatner wrote:
> Btw: Not sure if "effective" series isn't somehow propertiary and linked to Herb
> Sutter. I know he is not only responsible for c++ but also for c# version

I would refrain from naming it "Effective D". Scott Meyers is the author of several "Effective C++" books, and it would be disrespectful to try to trade off of that, even though there is an "Effective Java" by Bloch and an "Effective C#" by Wagner, etc.

Heck, to throw something out there, why not "D Best Practices"?

On 6/15/13 5:43 AM, Szymon Gatner wrote:
> Btw: Not sure if "effective" series isn't somehow propertiary and linked
> to Herb Sutter. I know he is not only responsible for c++ but also for
> c# version

The "Effective" series at AWL is directed by Scott Meyers and would not preclude one from using the title elsewhere. That being said, I mentioned the book last night to Scott and he said if the author wants to publish it in that series, he'd be glad to look into it.

Andrei

On 06/14/2013 07:17 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:

> It'll probably be the first book ever to be written entirely in ddoc.

The first ddoc book was a D book as well: ;)


http://code.google.com/p/ddili/source/browse/trunk/src/ders/d.en/foreach_opapply.d

Ali