On Sun, 12 May 2013 01:22:57 +0100, Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail@erdani.org> wrote:

> On 5/11/13 7:39 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
>> Furthermore, my whole point was nothing more than to merely suggest
>> that *maybe* the delay should simply be somewhat less, *not* a demand
>> or expectation, and *not* even a suggestion that they should all be
>> released as soon as is technically feasable.
>
> Sure - let's take a quick poll on what would be the best release schedule.

I agree that 2 a week is reasonable given the motivations and reasoning already discussed.

R

-- 
Using Opera's revolutionary email client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

On Sat, 11 May 2013 20:22:57 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail@erdani.org> wrote:

> On 5/11/13 7:39 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
>> Furthermore, my whole point was nothing more than to merely suggest
>> that *maybe* the delay should simply be somewhat less, *not* a demand
>> or expectation, and *not* even a suggestion that they should all be
>> released as soon as is technically feasable.
>
> Sure - let's take a quick poll on what would be the best release schedule.

I am happy with any reasonable schedule, including the current.  3 a week is max.

BTW, this whole "I need it now" mentality reminds me of my first days of having a TiVo.

My wife and I liked law and order (the show, but also the real thing too), and TiVo has a way to record all episodes (no repeats) of a specific show name, on any channel.  We set it up.

We were getting about 4-5 hours PER DAY of "Law and Order" to watch.  In about 4 days, I remember coming home and seeing 4 more hours and saying, "aw crap, we have four hours of TV to watch"  When it became a chore, we deleted the "season pass".

Now, this is different, because there are only 20 "episodes" in existence, and there will be no more until next year.  But the effect is similar.  I will watch one or two, and none of the others (I've seen them all live, mind you), but others will choose other talks to watch.  Already there have been some interesting discussions on the available talks that would be lost in the noise if all were immediately available.  It's nice to have everyone "stuck" at the same episode so you can discuss it at the same time!

Also keep in mind, that you can simply ignore the postings for a few weeks, and then all will be available at once.  This is like waiting for the season to come out on dvd or netflix :)

-Steve

On 5/13/2013 9:04 AM, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
> Also keep in mind, that you can simply ignore the postings for a few weeks, and
> then all will be available at once.  This is like waiting for the season to come
> out on dvd or netflix :)

Yeah, I'll often record a whole season on the dvr, then watch it in a marathon session!

On 2013-05-13 18:04, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:

> I am happy with any reasonable schedule, including the current.  3 a
> week is max.
>
> BTW, this whole "I need it now" mentality reminds me of my first days of
> having a TiVo.
>
> My wife and I liked law and order (the show, but also the real thing
> too), and TiVo has a way to record all episodes (no repeats) of a
> specific show name, on any channel.  We set it up.
>
> We were getting about 4-5 hours PER DAY of "Law and Order" to watch.  In
> about 4 days, I remember coming home and seeing 4 more hours and saying,
> "aw crap, we have four hours of TV to watch"  When it became a chore, we
> deleted the "season pass".

That's a bit much. I used to watch three episodes, around 40 minutes each, at once. Now I only have time for one episode. But I still get to see one per day.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg

On Mon, 13 May 2013 14:35:14 -0400, Jacob Carlborg <doob@me.com> wrote:

> On 2013-05-13 18:04, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
>
>> I am happy with any reasonable schedule, including the current.  3 a
>> week is max.
>>
>> BTW, this whole "I need it now" mentality reminds me of my first days of
>> having a TiVo.
>>
>> My wife and I liked law and order (the show, but also the real thing
>> too), and TiVo has a way to record all episodes (no repeats) of a
>> specific show name, on any channel.  We set it up.
>>
>> We were getting about 4-5 hours PER DAY of "Law and Order" to watch.  In
>> about 4 days, I remember coming home and seeing 4 more hours and saying,
>> "aw crap, we have four hours of TV to watch"  When it became a chore, we
>> deleted the "season pass".
>
> That's a bit much. I used to watch three episodes, around 40 minutes each, at once. Now I only have time for one episode. But I still get to see one per day.

My point was, I would not like to see d conference videos becoming a "chore" to watch so you can keep up with the latest discussion.

-Steve

On Sunday, 12 May 2013 at 13:49:05 UTC, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:
> On Sunday, 12 May 2013 at 00:22:58 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
>> Sure - let's take a quick poll on what would be the best release schedule.
>
> I kinda like the idea of one a day on monday/wednesday/friday. It'd be paced kinda like a college class then, easy to remember timing, and should keep a pretty steady discussion going.

+1

On 2013-05-13 20:41, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:

> My point was, I would not like to see d conference videos becoming a
> "chore" to watch so you can keep up with the latest discussion.

Oh, you mean the discussion. I was just thinking, if you don't want to watch more, then don't.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg

On 5/13/13, Steven Schveighoffer <schveiguy@yahoo.com> wrote:
> In about 4 days, I remember coming home and seeing 4 more hours and saying, "aw crap, we have four hours of TV to watch"  When it became a chore, we deleted the "season pass".

Isn't this an issue with Tivo only having limited space to keep the episodes, essentially forcing you to watch something or delete it? This is not an issue with your average PC hard drive.

Also, you may not want to watch every episode. For example if I think an episode is bad I just won't watch it, I'll watch the next episode. This probably won't work with series that have a continuous storyline, but with conference videos every "episode" is unique, and I'm really not interested in all of them. Having a delay of several days between releases does nothing to make me more interested in a talk.

As for watching several hours per day, that's ok with me (e.g. if it's a really good series). If I have a free day to spare I'll watch any number of episodes if it's a really good show (Breaking Bad, Dexter, La Femme Nikita, just to name a few, were all great to watch eagerly).

But this is clearly a YMMV territory, everyone has different needs.

Anyway I wish this PR stunt was announce *beforehand*.

On Monday, May 13, 2013 23:43:01 Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
> Anyway I wish this PR stunt was announce *beforehand*.

Well, AFAIK, it was never stated that the videos would be posted quickly. For a while, it wasn't even clear whether the conference would even be recorded. So, we're very lucky to have what we have, and Andrei isn't doing anything different from what he said he was going to do. He just isn't doing what some people expected.

- Jonathan M Davis

On Mon, 13 May 2013 17:43:01 -0400, Andrej Mitrovic <andrej.mitrovich@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 5/13/13, Steven Schveighoffer <schveiguy@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> In about 4 days, I remember coming home and seeing 4 more hours and saying,
>> "aw crap, we have four hours of TV to watch"  When it became a chore, we
>> deleted the "season pass".
>
> Isn't this an issue with Tivo only having limited space to keep the
> episodes, essentially forcing you to watch something or delete it?
> This is not an issue with your average PC hard drive.

In our case, it was more of the fact that we didn't have time to watch all Law and Order episodes in existence, as there was about 4 per day on TNT + the newest one on NBC or whatever channel that was :)  At the time, I had I think 80 hours available (at low quality), so running out of space was not a problem.  But there is something about having it *available* that compels you to watch it, and eventually ends up making you resent the availability, however irrational that is (I mean, TiVo took the time to record all these, the least we can do is watch them.  He's so cute too, why do they make him so CUTE with that fucking smile and sliding through the virtual world of video bits!  Curse you TiVo!)

But it's not a direct comparison, as I noted.  The issue I think we want to avoid is to have everyone HAVING to watch all the talks in order to participate in the discussion.  All us conference goers could be having related "insiders" discussions all over the newsgroups, but I think we have all pretty much refrained from doing that.  Even if that's not the main point of the delay, it's good to consider that NG threads have a short life, and you want to have as many involved as possible.

> Also, you may not want to watch every episode. For example if I think
> an episode is bad I just won't watch it, I'll watch the next episode.
> This probably won't work with series that have a continuous storyline,
> but with conference videos every "episode" is unique, and I'm really
> not interested in all of them. Having a delay of several days between
> releases does nothing to make me more interested in a talk.

Believe me, I was definitely interested only in a few, and I was just a bit unenthusiastic on watching all of them to get to those.  I was very much proven wrong.  All the talks were good.  I think this is important to note.

> As for watching several hours per day, that's ok with me (e.g. if it's
> a really good series). If I have a free day to spare I'll watch any
> number of episodes if it's a really good show (Breaking Bad, Dexter,
> La Femme Nikita, just to name a few, were all great to watch eagerly).

It shouldn't be a requirement, though.

> But this is clearly a YMMV territory, everyone has different needs.
>
> Anyway I wish this PR stunt was announce *beforehand*.

I think part of it is logistics and preparation.  You simply can't upload them all at once and have them all available at once.  There must be SOME delay between postings that lasts longer than watching each video.  The extension is simply to spread out the discussion/impact.  I think it is a wise PR move.

-Steve