Hi all. What do you about WinRT? I think this new APIs could be a very interesting point for D... they are open to any language and i think that D is perfect to work with them. What's your opinion? Best regards

"RenatoL" <renato@relhost.net> wrote in message news:j62nl3$21g5$1@digitalmars.com...
> Hi all. What do you about WinRT? I think this new APIs could be a very interesting point for D... they are open to any language and i think that D is perfect to work with them. What's your opinion? Best regards

Hmm, this is the first I've heard of it. Looking at the wikipedia page and winsupersite article, I can imagine it being either very good or irritating and patronizing. Hard to say. But after seeing the Win8 UI videos (and after using both Vista and Win7) I find it very difficult to get excited about anything in Win8.

Ouch, I just saw this bit at the end of Paul Thurrott's winsupersite article:

"Virtually all of the Microsoft WinRT apps--Mail, Calendar, People, Chat, and so on--are all written in HTML and JavaScript"

Apparently all the grown-ups have left Microsoft. Fuck that shit. I'm not touching Win8 with the proverbial ten foot poll.

Eh eh, it may be strange something good come out from MS... but i think this time we could look at this with interest.... this an object replacement for win32 and the OS exposes it in an "open" way... i believe this is good for D (and Delphi, Scala....)

"RenatoL" <renato@relhost.net> wrote in message news:j62q4v$25tn$1@digitalmars.com...
> Eh eh, it may be strange something good come out from MS... but i think this time we could look at this with interest.... this an object replacement for win32 and the OS exposes it in an "open" way... i believe this is good for D (and Delphi, Scala....)

I'm not sure it's so good for D. Some of the comments here...

http://www.winsupersite.com/blog/supersite-blog-39/windows8/winrt-replacing-win32-140605

...seem to suggest that HTML/JS/etc apps will have roughly the same speed as native C++ apps. If that's true, then it can only mean that Win8 severely gimps the performance of natively-compiled apps. It's not as if they've found some magic technology to install a native-JS-executing CPU into your computer.

Of course, this is all getting *very* speculative at this point.

On 2011-09-30 00:13, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
> "RenatoL"<renato@relhost.net>  wrote in message
> news:j62q4v$25tn$1@digitalmars.com...
>> Eh eh, it may be strange something good come out from MS... but i
>> think this time we could look at this with interest.... this an
>> object replacement for win32 and the OS exposes it in an "open"
>> way... i believe this is good for D (and Delphi, Scala....)
>
> I'm not sure it's so good for D. Some of the comments here...
>
> http://www.winsupersite.com/blog/supersite-blog-39/windows8/winrt-replacing-win32-140605
>
> ...seem to suggest that HTML/JS/etc apps will have roughly the same speed as
> native C++ apps. If that's true, then it can only mean that Win8 severely
> gimps the performance of natively-compiled apps. It's not as if they've
> found some magic technology to install a native-JS-executing CPU into your
> computer.

That's very hard to believe.

> Of course, this is all getting *very* speculative at this point.

I've watched two video clips from the Build conference about C++, one was about C++ in WinRT. It looks and sounds pretty good to me, although I haven't looked at any other parts of Windows 8. I like the idea of having a completely object oriented system API that you also can share among other languages.

Note that it's not often I say something good about Microsoft.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg

"Nick Sabalausky" <a@a.a> wrote in message news:j62qi9$26i2$1@digitalmars.com...

> ...seem to suggest that HTML/JS/etc apps will have roughly the same speed as native C++ apps. If that's true, then it can only mean that Win8 severely gimps the performance of natively-compiled apps. It's not as if they've found some magic technology to install a native-JS-executing CPU into your computer.
>

It looks - Intel parallelized JS by OpenCL https://github.com/RiverTrail/RiverTrail/wiki and just
announced with Samsung - Tizen (www.tizen.org) with HTML5/JS as major GUI components builders on top of  dead Meego.

Oleg.

On 2011-09-29 21:23:48 +0000, RenatoL <renato@relhost.net> said:

> Hi all. What do you about WinRT? I think this new APIs could be a
> very interesting point for D... they are open to any language and
> i think that D is perfect to work with them. What's your opinion?
> Best regards

From what I understand, WinRT is based on COM. D already supports COM, so it might already be doable by declaring the right interfaces as derivatives of IUnknown.

I suggest you give it a try.

That said, the automatic reference counting they added to WinRT types in Visual C++ won't be available without compiler support (but you can do it manually), and neither will the compiler-generated reflection data (you'll have to generate it yourself).

-- 
Michel Fortin
michel.fortin@michelf.com
http://michelf.com/

On 2011-09-30 12:58, Michel Fortin wrote:
> On 2011-09-29 21:23:48 +0000, RenatoL <renato@relhost.net> said:
>
>> Hi all. What do you about WinRT? I think this new APIs could be a
>> very interesting point for D... they are open to any language and
>> i think that D is perfect to work with them. What's your opinion?
>> Best regards
>
>  From what I understand, WinRT is based on COM. D already supports COM,
> so it might already be doable by declaring the right interfaces as
> derivatives of IUnknown.
>
> I suggest you give it a try.
>
> That said, the automatic reference counting they added to WinRT types in
> Visual C++ won't be available without compiler support (but you can do
> it manually), and neither will the compiler-generated reflection data
> (you'll have to generate it yourself).

Doesn't the garbage collector implement reference counting or similar when implementing from IUnknown?

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg

On 2011-09-30 14:05:28 +0000, Jacob Carlborg <doob@me.com> said:

> On 2011-09-30 12:58, Michel Fortin wrote:
>> On 2011-09-29 21:23:48 +0000, RenatoL <renato@relhost.net> said:
>> 
>>> Hi all. What do you about WinRT? I think this new APIs could be a
>>> very interesting point for D... they are open to any language and
>>> i think that D is perfect to work with them. What's your opinion?
>>> Best regards
>> 
>>  From what I understand, WinRT is based on COM. D already supports COM,
>> so it might already be doable by declaring the right interfaces as
>> derivatives of IUnknown.
>> 
>> I suggest you give it a try.
>> 
>> That said, the automatic reference counting they added to WinRT types in
>> Visual C++ won't be available without compiler support (but you can do
>> it manually), and neither will the compiler-generated reflection data
>> (you'll have to generate it yourself).
> 
> Doesn't the garbage collector implement reference counting or similar when implementing from IUnknown?

Would be great, but it's not mentioned in the language spec so I somewhat doubt it.
<http://www.d-programming-language.org/interface.html#COM-Interfaces>

-- 
Michel Fortin
michel.fortin@michelf.com
http://michelf.com/

On 2011-10-01 23:44, Michel Fortin wrote:
> On 2011-09-30 14:05:28 +0000, Jacob Carlborg <doob@me.com> said:
>
>> On 2011-09-30 12:58, Michel Fortin wrote:
>>> On 2011-09-29 21:23:48 +0000, RenatoL <renato@relhost.net> said:
>>>
>>>> Hi all. What do you about WinRT? I think this new APIs could be a
>>>> very interesting point for D... they are open to any language and
>>>> i think that D is perfect to work with them. What's your opinion?
>>>> Best regards
>>>
>>> From what I understand, WinRT is based on COM. D already supports COM,
>>> so it might already be doable by declaring the right interfaces as
>>> derivatives of IUnknown.
>>>
>>> I suggest you give it a try.
>>>
>>> That said, the automatic reference counting they added to WinRT types in
>>> Visual C++ won't be available without compiler support (but you can do
>>> it manually), and neither will the compiler-generated reflection data
>>> (you'll have to generate it yourself).
>>
>> Doesn't the garbage collector implement reference counting or similar
>> when implementing from IUnknown?
>
> Would be great, but it's not mentioned in the language spec so I
> somewhat doubt it.
> <http://www.d-programming-language.org/interface.html#COM-Interfaces>
>

Perhpas I was thinking about this: https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/druntime/blob/master/src/rt/lifetime.d#L103 (the comment)

But that might not be automatically called.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg