On Saturday, 7 December 2019 at 21:59:28 UTC, JN wrote:
> On Saturday, 7 December 2019 at 21:38:16 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
>> Is Ruby being swallowed up by Python perhaps?
>
> Has been for quite some time. Ruby was never that popular outside of Ruby on Rails. For the most part, RoR was Ruby. But RoR is not as popular anymore, Python and other languages adopted similar ideas for web frameworks and ate Ruby's lunch. Outside of Homebrew on macOS and Jekyll, the blog engine, I am not aware of any popular Ruby usages in the wild nowadays.

Ruby's far from dead, and a lot more than just Homebrew and Jekyll. For obvious reasons, Basecamp uses it. Github and Gitlab both use it. Sinatra is still very popular as is the mail gem. Some others that come to mind are Chatwoot, Redmine, and OpenProject. There are tons of others. I'd be very happy if D could reach the popularity of Ruby.

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:12:39 UTC, bachmeier wrote:
> On Saturday, 7 December 2019 at 21:59:28 UTC, JN wrote:
>> On Saturday, 7 December 2019 at 21:38:16 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
>>> Is Ruby being swallowed up by Python perhaps?
>>
>> Has been for quite some time. Ruby was never that popular outside of Ruby on Rails. For the most part, RoR was Ruby. But RoR is not as popular anymore, Python and other languages adopted similar ideas for web frameworks and ate Ruby's lunch. Outside of Homebrew on macOS and Jekyll, the blog engine, I am not aware of any popular Ruby usages in the wild nowadays.
>
> Ruby's far from dead, and a lot more than just Homebrew and Jekyll. For obvious reasons, Basecamp uses it. Github and Gitlab both use it. Sinatra is still very popular as is the mail gem. Some others that come to mind are Chatwoot, Redmine, and OpenProject. There are tons of others. I'd be very happy if D could reach the popularity of Ruby.

I forgot Discourse

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:14:58 UTC, bachmeier wrote:
> On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:12:39 UTC, bachmeier wrote:
>> On Saturday, 7 December 2019 at 21:59:28 UTC, JN wrote:
>>> On Saturday, 7 December 2019 at 21:38:16 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
>>>> Is Ruby being swallowed up by Python perhaps?
>>>
>>> Has been for quite some time. Ruby was never that popular outside of Ruby on Rails. For the most part, RoR was Ruby. But RoR is not as popular anymore, Python and other languages adopted similar ideas for web frameworks and ate Ruby's lunch. Outside of Homebrew on macOS and Jekyll, the blog engine, I am not aware of any popular Ruby usages in the wild nowadays.
>>
>> Ruby's far from dead, and a lot more than just Homebrew and Jekyll. For obvious reasons, Basecamp uses it. Github and Gitlab both use it. Sinatra is still very popular as is the mail gem. Some others that come to mind are Chatwoot, Redmine, and OpenProject. There are tons of others. I'd be very happy if D could reach the popularity of Ruby.
>
> I forgot Discourse

You also forgot that Oracle, Red-Hat and IBM spend resources making Ruby JIT compilers, via Graal, Truffle, JRuby and RubyOMR projects.

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:12:39 UTC, bachmeier wrote:
> Ruby's far from dead, and a lot more than just Homebrew and Jekyll. For obvious reasons, Basecamp uses it. Github and Gitlab both use it. Sinatra is still very popular as is the

Yes, Ruby is twice as large as Go (roughly) in terms of projects that are being maintained, but much worse off than Python:

https://www.openhub.net/languages/compare?utf8=%E2%9C%93&measure=projects&language_name%5B%5D=python&language_name%5B%5D=ruby&language_name%5B%5D=golang

Enthusiasm is pointing the wrong way.

5 years ago Ruby had almost 9% of the stars on github, today 2%.
In the same timeframe Python has increased from 10% to 14%.

Ruby seems to be on the long tail, meaning existing code bases drive most of the activity. Not sure how that can change?

D has been very stable on github metrics for the past 6 years. Unlikely to change much unless it is made easier to use. (What got D attention in the beginning was that it was much easier to use than C++)

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:45:54 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
> Ruby seems to be on the long tail, meaning existing code bases drive most of the activity. Not sure how that can change?

Ruby 3 in a few weeks. Better performance, duck typing to help the IDEs, better concurrency and parallelism story.

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:45:54 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
> On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:12:39 UTC, bachmeier wrote:
>> Ruby's far from dead, and a lot more than just Homebrew and Jekyll. For obvious reasons, Basecamp uses it. Github and Gitlab both use it. Sinatra is still very popular as is the
>
> Yes, Ruby is twice as large as Go (roughly) in terms of projects that are being maintained, but much worse off than Python:

Python's a juggernaut. There's no shame in failing to be as popular as Python. I don't particularly care for the language, but obviously a lot of people do or more likely don't care enough to use something else.

Where D comes in is with a good interoperability story for both Ruby and Python. If we succeed at that, which we unfortunately have not yet done, we benefit from their popularity.

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 16:05:19 UTC, bachmeier wrote:
> Where D comes in is with a good interoperability story for both Ruby and Python. If we succeed at that, which we unfortunately have not yet done, we benefit from their popularity.

That could happen, my impression from the D community is that there is one group who are "library developers" and  another group that want to be "application developers".

Though, the best integration on the horizon is WebAssembly, which will allow you to write engines (libraries) for any language.

So Sebastiaan Koppe's work on WebAssembly might become significant. Language contenders with tight codegen, good debugging support (DWARF) and low memory usage could easily take off in the next 2-3 years.

Rust and AssemblyScript has a head start though...

Another integration path to watch out for is Dart. Who is now getting foreign function invocation so that means D could attach itself to Flutter (GUI for iOS, Android, Desktop and Web) and benefit from that ecosystem. I think arrays are still missing though.

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 16:33:27 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:

> So Sebastiaan Koppe's work on WebAssembly might become significant. Language contenders with tight codegen, good debugging support (DWARF) and low memory usage could easily take off in the next 2-3 years.

Yes, he's doing critically important work to make D available in more places. Not my area at all, but clearly a big target.

> Another integration path to watch out for is Dart. Who is now getting foreign function invocation so that means D could attach itself to Flutter (GUI for iOS, Android, Desktop and Web) and benefit from that ecosystem. I think arrays are still missing though.

I've looked into this, and dpp gives it to us for free, as far as I can tell. Friendly wrappers will improve the experience, but the big hurdle of bindings to the basic functionality is already solved.

On Saturday, 7 December 2019 at 20:41:37 UTC, JN wrote:
> Dart's dramatic rise is interesting. I attribute it to Flutter, but it's crazy how much up it went.

On this graph you can see the spikes for Flutter (announcements):

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%205-y&q=golang,typescript,kotlin,flutter

Also plotted in other unique terms to show how fast Flutter is going up.

On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:49:54 UTC, Eugene Wissner wrote:
> On Monday, 9 December 2019 at 14:45:54 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
>> Ruby seems to be on the long tail, meaning existing code bases drive most of the activity. Not sure how that can change?
>
> Ruby 3 in a few weeks. Better performance, duck typing to help the IDEs, better concurrency and parallelism story.

You are one yer to early! :-)

https://www.quora.com/When-will-Ruby-3-0-release

They say it will be December 2020.