On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 15:48:34 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:

Is D a system language or it is a language to do websites?

Can D's GC compete with Javascript's V8 GC?

Dart uses AOT for release

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 16:22:50 UTC, ryuukk_ wrote:

I primarily use D to do websites.

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 16:37:26 UTC, Adam D Ruppe wrote:

As a front-end?

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 16:22:50 UTC, ryuukk_ wrote:

Now you confuse me. We were talking about why C++ is less needed in GUI development now in comparison to the 90s.

Javascript has been used for iPhone apps for at least a decade, in WebViews. Regular end users often didn't notice the difference as they were dressed up as native widgets and fine tuned. Or they used native widgets controlled by JavaScript.

JavaScript, Lua and other scripting languages have been used for GUIs of games, mobile apps and desktop apps even when the application engine is written in C++.

The ui-logic is often not very demanding. Which is why this approach makes sense.

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 16:50:36 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:

The topic was why Apple ditch C++/LLVM and why it's being phased out as a language

Then you said some things about the future is JIT and GCs

Then i said, that's why D doesn't grow

You derailed, i tried to put topic on track

OP title is "Zig vs D generics", not GCs, JITs or C++

Otherwise we do Java and we don't need generics, or we do Javascript and dynamic and we don't need no struct

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 17:19:57 UTC, ryuukk_ wrote:

This never happend. There is no point in propagating this assumption. Let's stick to the facts:

https://jobs.apple.com/en-us/details/200310241/c-compiler-engineer

I said that for the UI, scripting languages with JITs are probably more suitable than C++ and similar languages. Which is a historical evolution that follows the development of hardware. This is just a reflection of reality. I am not talking about the future. I am talking about the past and the present. This is not a new trend.

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 17:36:55 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:

Apple went with Swift as an evolution to C++ and ObjC; no JIT and no GC and yet it powers SwiftUI, modern, easy to use and efficient declarative UI framework

They didn't lower their standard when they came up with something new, they stick to their motto

Where is async in D btw?

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 17:59:37 UTC, ryuukk_ wrote:

This is getting very off topic. Apple has always had a lock-in strategy where they try to get developers to create "iOS only apps" and "iOS first apps". This is a political game, not a technical one. They did the same with the GPU API Metal.

You can control a 2D UI from a scripting language or from D, but there will be no noticeable performance difference on modern hardware. Both approaches are equally valid.

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 18:06:15 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:

It has nothing to do with politics, it has to do with efficiency, apple was in the krhonos working groupd for vulkan, but they decided against it and went with their own due to specific needs

Instead they proposed WebGPU, common interface powered by native implementation for each OS, and that one is a huge success

https://architosh.com/2017/02/apples-webgpu-standard-proposal-aiming-at-common-access-to-explicit-graphics/

On Wednesday, 12 October 2022 at 18:24:39 UTC, ryuukk_ wrote:

An upcoming W3C standard for browsers. If you set the trajectory then you secure the position of your own product. You have to look at that in conjunction with WebGL2:

https://registry.khronos.org/webgl/specs/latest/2.0-compute/

This has no relevance for D though.