Hi everyone,

I've just read that there are only 5 days remaining for organization applications
http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013

Will Digitalmars do it a further year? Or are there too many resources spent on managing DConf?

Personally, I'd like to participate in the event a second time - not only for the $5k (+$500 for the mentor) to get - hoping that we can improve our toolchains another time (and/or finally move away from the goddamn conservative GC!)

I dunno whether Andrei or Walter really want to process through all this stuff again, but it was kinda nice to see the Digitalmars rising up once more :-)

I forgot to specify the topic I'd like to work on:

To implement CTFE of D code under .Net - whereas the D code should become compiled into CIL (Common language runtime Intermediate Language, an assembler-like language), so one could execute the 'final' program directly in a .Net environment.
I know this goal can never be reached within one summer of code - and it's also rather experimental / an entire compiler back-end that has to be implemented (The front-end is mostly there already ;-)) + perhaps needs a bunch of people for such a huge thing, but well..why not?

On Sunday, 24 March 2013 at 14:48:30 UTC, alex wrote:
> I've just read that there are only 5 days remaining for organization applications
> http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013
>
> Will Digitalmars do it a further year? Or are there too many resources spent on managing DConf?

I was meaning to write this post myself right now:

In my opinion, we can't afford to miss the chance to participate in the Summer of Code for a third time. For this to be possible, though, we ned to throw together an application, and pronto.

Also, as far as I can see, in both of the previous two years, the work by one student was not actually incorporated into the upstream projects or made available in an easily usable way: Cristi Cobzarenco's SciD work from 2011) and Antti-Ville Tuunainen's garbage collector improvements from last year. (Note aside: It seems like in both of the cases, David Simcha was the mentor, but this could just be a coincidence.)

We need to quickly come up with and commit to a strategy to make sure this does not happen again. Otherwise, this will look very bad on an application for this year.

David

On 3/24/13 10:48 AM, alex wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I've just read that there are only 5 days remaining for organization
> applications
> http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013
>
> Will Digitalmars do it a further year? Or are there too many resources
> spent on managing DConf?
>
> Personally, I'd like to participate in the event a second time - not
> only for the $5k (+$500 for the mentor) to get - hoping that we can
> improve our toolchains another time (and/or finally move away from the
> goddamn conservative GC!)
>
> I dunno whether Andrei or Walter really want to process through all this
> stuff again, but it was kinda nice to see the Digitalmars rising up once
> more :-)

Yes, we do want to participate to this year's edition, I was about to send a request for mentors.

Andrei

On Sunday, 24 March 2013 at 15:39:37 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
> On 3/24/13 10:48 AM, alex wrote:
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> I've just read that there are only 5 days remaining for organization
>> applications
>> http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013
>>
>> Will Digitalmars do it a further year? Or are there too many resources
>> spent on managing DConf?
>>
>> Personally, I'd like to participate in the event a second time - not
>> only for the $5k (+$500 for the mentor) to get - hoping that we can
>> improve our toolchains another time (and/or finally move away from the
>> goddamn conservative GC!)
>>
>> I dunno whether Andrei or Walter really want to process through all this
>> stuff again, but it was kinda nice to see the Digitalmars rising up once
>> more :-)
>
> Yes, we do want to participate to this year's edition, I was about to send a request for mentors.
>
> Andrei

Nice! Thank you!

I already wondered why nobody ever mentioned the new GSoC in the NG :)

24-Mar-2013 19:25, David Nadlinger пишет:
> On Sunday, 24 March 2013 at 14:48:30 UTC, alex wrote:
>> I've just read that there are only 5 days remaining for organization
>> applications
>> http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013
>>
>> Will Digitalmars do it a further year? Or are there too many resources
>> spent on managing DConf?
>
> I was meaning to write this post myself right now:
>
> In my opinion, we can't afford to miss the chance to participate in the
> Summer of Code for a third time. For this to be possible, though, we ned
> to throw together an application, and pronto.
>

Sure, and AFAICT for that to happen we need at least an ideas page. Shouldn't be hard to put together.
For one idea I'd love to see more D support in embedded/ARM world e.g. an easy to use STM32 quick-start package would be nice.

> Also, as far as I can see, in both of the previous two years, the work
> by one student was not actually incorporated into the upstream projects
> or made available in an easily usable way: Cristi Cobzarenco's SciD work
> from 2011) and Antti-Ville Tuunainen's garbage collector improvements
> from last year. (Note aside: It seems like in both of the cases, David
> Simcha was the mentor, but this could just be a coincidence.)

It might be only my perception but one common case in both of these projects is using the only recently available features (RTInfo hook) and otherwise hitting rough places of compiler (e.g. defunct post-blit back then).

That being said I think we (D GSoC-ers) can testify that overcoming D's implementation limitations (~bugs) proves to take not a small amount of time allocated for the project. But this year it should be easier, heh?

> We need to quickly come up with and commit to a strategy to make sure
> this does not happen again. Otherwise, this will look very bad on an
> application for this year.

Maybe focus on bite-sized deliverables?
Also maybe having explicitly listed minor/major goals, a plan-B in case something doesn't work out etc.


-- 
Dmitry Olshansky

On 2013-03-24 17:01, Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

> Sure, and AFAICT for that to happen we need at least an ideas page.
> Shouldn't be hard to put together.
> For one idea I'd love to see more D support in embedded/ARM world e.g.
> an easy to use STM32 quick-start package would be nice.

There's always the ideas from previous years.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 08:07:24 -0700, alex <info@alexanderbothe.com> wrote:

> I forgot to specify the topic I'd like to work on:
>
> To implement CTFE of D code under .Net - whereas the D code should become compiled into CIL (Common language runtime Intermediate Language, an assembler-like language), so one could execute the 'final' program directly in a .Net environment.
> I know this goal can never be reached within one summer of code - and it's also rather experimental / an entire compiler back-end that has to be implemented (The front-end is mostly there already ;-)) + perhaps needs a bunch of people for such a huge thing, but well..why not?

I just want to throw some caution into the wind here. Many people have tried emitting CIL from D source, and have had varying levels of success. Ranges in particular seems to a pain point as the CIL has no way to express that concept natively. I am not saying this isn't a good idea, as it's the only realistic way to do CTFE in the .NET world, just something to be careful when approaching.

That said, I come from the C#/.NET world and would love to help make this happen.

-- 
Adam Wilson
IRC: LightBender
Project Coordinator
The Horizon Project
http://www.thehorizonproject.org/

On Sunday, 24 March 2013 at 20:22:56 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote:
> I just want to throw some caution into the wind here. Many people have tried emitting CIL from D source, and have had varying levels of success. Ranges in particular seems to a pain point as the CIL has no way to express that concept natively. I am not saying this isn't a good idea, as it's the only realistic way to do CTFE in the .NET world, just something to be careful when approaching.

Ranges.. in .Net there's something beautiful called List, which imho could somehow be used for wrapping e.g. array slices. I mean, even if it's a workaround it's still considering the functionality

> That said, I come from the C#/.NET world and would love to help make this happen.

Yeah, would love that, too. But then there's also a question of effort vs. gain - is another "compiler" really needed? Is it worth the 2 years of CTFE implementation brainfuck? Hmm.

On 03/24/2013 09:42 PM, alex wrote:
> On Sunday, 24 March 2013 at 20:22:56 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote:
>> I just want to throw some caution into the wind here. Many people have
>> tried emitting CIL from D source, and have had varying levels of
>> success. Ranges in particular seems to a pain point as the CIL has no
>> way to express that concept natively. I am not saying this isn't a
>> good idea, as it's the only realistic way to do CTFE in the .NET
>> world, just something to be careful when approaching.
>
> Ranges.. in .Net there's something beautiful called List, which imho
> could somehow be used for wrapping e.g. array slices. I mean, even if
> it's a workaround it's still considering the functionality
>
>> That said, I come from the C#/.NET world and would love to help make
>> this happen.
>
> Yeah, would love that, too. But then there's also a question of effort
> vs. gain - is another "compiler" really needed? Is it worth the 2 years
> of CTFE implementation brainfuck? Hmm.

The front end is the hard part. The D AST => CIL transformation is rather easy.